I really like your idea seanw3 and would strongly support it.  The last thing we want is the hero trait system, arguably one of the best systems in the game, become bogged down in over-randomness and lack of specialisation and making it too easy to become a jack of all trades (or is that traits? ).

Might I also suggest toning down hitpoints for heroes, to make constitution related traits more of a good choice.

And for this, we need to be able to select what place (number) in the party a unit or champion is.  At the very least we need to be able to define the leader.

This does seem to make good sense, and possibly help with making it easier to balance.  HOWEVER, I would miss the randomness, in the fact that I could not change my mind later in this system to reclass, and would limit the ability to make a good all around hero.  Say I am making a firemage then realize I have no way to secure many shards and I need to go a different direction, it would be disappointing to be stuck in a certain path.

The point is to make class choices every 3 levels. The stuff inbetween is a random traits from the traits you have unlocked in your class. It would also have the general pool of random and the possibility to choose a new path (except it would have to be a different path, not a new class in your current path). 

The fire mage example wouldn't apply because all the classes in the mage path are only giving bonuses to any spell cast. And on another note, if you do try to make a fire wizard without a plan to get a shard, you need to rethink how you make strategies. 

And I am not even suggesting that the whole system be added to the game. We just need some progression like this. All the mods I am planning will probably use a similar system. 

The part you can't really see in the theory is that when the max number of trait options is set to 10, you can then afford to set the rarity of paths to 100% (always show them) as well as the class traits. So you would have probably 4 traits that are not random (ones that are from class choices) show up on every level, plus 3 or so random traits that you could choose if they were better for your hero given your unique position at that point in the game. You could also allow every path to always be an option when the level up screen pops up. There is really alot that can be done here. 

If I had my way- the paths would also unlock later on after say level 5, you'd have a chance to get character classes if you had the right stats.

Classes would unlock additional stronger promotions (Rare though)

I'd dump paths into four: Governor, Rogue, Warrior, Mage

Example of classes:

Ranger might require a certain DEX and Con.  Ranger would unlock terrain bonuses, archery damage, and chance to tame animals.

Paladin might require Life magic+STR+INT.  Would give group healing bonues, courage, etc...

Pyromancer might require a certain level of Fire Mastery.

Pyromancer might be the only way to get level 5 spells, but would give a penalty to water/air/earth magic.

This is in response to the original post:

My distaste for all things random aside, I'm at a loss as to what route you are taking in implementing this. Are the skills in between levels left blank because you haven't thought of what they will be, that they will intentionally be nothing (and give stat boosts or something), or that they will use the same random pool already present.

And on that note: How do you plan to organize these random traits? You suggested 8 possibilities per level up. Will some of these be static, will some of them be more rare than others? And if so how you will accomodate for rare traits appearing with common ones, or rare traits not showing up at all for several levels?

The leader path is not viable as he cannot kill enemies to level up.

I like this alot, seanw.  Here's my post from the other thread, just to keep it out there.  We probably need a "general (warleader)" path and a "administrator" path as well.

The decision when a hero is hired should be what the hero will do, either sit in your capital or other city (in which case he/she/it should have faction wide bonuses, not city bonuses), or be an adventurer.  I know it was discussed elsewhere for city bound heros getting some exp/season for sitting home, and my suggestion to that is that all the administrator heroes gain exp whenever a building or unit is built in any city, or if any city is successfully defended against attack.  That's the role of those heroes, making your civilization stronger; reward them for that.

I'd like to talk mostly about the adventuring heroes, and how to differentiate them.

It looks like there's only one type now; arcane warrior.  A person with armor and an axe that can cast spells.  There aught to be 4 types: Gimli (melee/aggro), Gandalf(defensive spellcaster), Saruman (offensive spellcaster), Strider (ranger/leader).

Melee/aggro should be able to wear plate, and should have traits that make them more likely to be targetted by the AI.  Some damage output.

Defensive casters should be able to wear robes only (and there should be robes in the magic/warfare crossover tree that can be built with crystal that gives advantages to this kind of hero), and should have faster access to buffs/heals

Offensive casters should be able to wear robes only, and have access to DD and AOE spells faster.

Rangers/Leaders should have some ranged attack, and have traits/levelups that allow the whole army to gain bonuses.

My personal opinion is that we should be leveling up more, not less, to get more specialized traits, but not have any (or very little) intrinsic level up bonuses like HP.  If I want a Saruman, he's gonna be a paper cannon, and I need to defend him on the battlefield.  Don't give him 100 hp at level 15.

But I'd like to see level 30 heroes with lots of specialization.  There doesn't seem to be that much right now.

I also like the differentiation between melee soak (warrior) and melee dish out (rogue).  Limit rogues to leather, increase their initiative.  Give them invisibility traits, but make them only able to handle single units (or few units; I don't see a rogue backstabbing a whole company).  But to get rid of that caster in the back row making things not go your way?  Bring a fast, invisible, high initiative rogue, and get the job done right.

Traits ARE the key, though.  And we need to be able to put traits on built units that allow for spellcasting, but that's a different discussion.

I am hoping that at this point, we're working out game mechanics, and that all this stuff we're talking about can be modded in using XML closer to release, but the Stardock guys are looking to see if any basic mechanics are broken or need fixing, and of course stability.

I would call them "Path Traits" and "Meta Traits."

Great idea.

This is a blown up version of the Fighter section. It would only go to level 5 and then you would choose a specialization. Each specialization further develops your character.

The A and B traits are mutually exclusive. The idea is that you choose between one of those two traits or from the random pool. There will be 2 class traits and at least 3 random options. At level 6 you may choose another Path or one of the next classes in this path. You could therefore make a multiclassed hero like a Spellsword or Battlemage. The options are endless. 

Warriors would be: