Excuse me for interrupting this debate on what one passage means, but I would like to ask a question of both of you. Where did you find in scripture anything that states that the Elohim were God?
I never said that you were wrong in quoting scripture or your exposition of it, (although I do think that on occassion), to Lulapilgrim. It might be better of you would learn to read what is written. I said that you were willing to argue it with her, although you do have a tendencyto dimiss her when you discover that she's not buying what you are selling, and I gave the reasons as to why I think that you are willing. You seem to be afraid of me and think that I am
What did Jesus tell the wealthy man who wanted to follow him, even though he was a "righteous and just man" in his heart and kept all the commandments that were given to the hebrew nation? Do you remember? Let me refresh your memeory. St. Matthew chapter 19 verse 20- 21 "The young man said to him, All these I have kept; what is yet wanting to me?" Jesus said to him, "If thou wilt be perfect, go, sell what thou hast and give to the poor, an
Why would you assume that I am angry with you? I never said that. Nor am I angry with you. I told you the truth of what I see. You may not like it, and you may disagree with it, but it is what I see when I look at your postings. It doesn't mean that I hate you, unless of course you associate hearing those things that you do not care to hear, with hate. Yes you do use scripture that you think answers the questi
Why do you say that Christ founded a church? No where have I read that he did. Peter supposedly did (you are the rock upon which my church shall be built), but Jesus's prediction of that doesn't necessarily mean that he approved of it nor that he wanted it to happen. The fact that he said "my church" means nothing other than his name would be associated with it, to assume that it does mean more is strictly that, just "assumption". Christ worshipped in temple
I do agree with John, the bible does not contain all the truths necessary for salvation. There are just somethings that must be searched for and experienced for oneself. If one doesn't make the effort to find them out for oneself, one will never know what those things are. Jesus gave the steps to find them, it's up to the individual to make the effort. I find it hard to believe that all the words in the bible are "God inspired". Too many are in conflict w
So you are telling me that it's only your faith that tells you that the words of Paul are truth? If I may ask, why don't you bother to put them to the test? Jesus said that one could ask and be given. He didn't put any stipulations on what could be asked for that I know of. Why don't you ask, instead of relying on faith? Are you afraid of asking, or afraid of finding out the truth? Is it not worth the time to ask? I'm not assuming that you
You say that Paul was inspired by God. How do you know this to be true? Other than taking Paul's word for it that is. This is a man who had set out to hunt the apostles down and kill them. His miracle with Jesus was not seen by anybody but himself. The only witnesses to it, saw a bright light but didn't hear anything. I deal in proof only, faith is not an option. You say that the bible is a literary output of certain people. In that case Paul
Well I suppose if a voice came out of nowhere and told me that it was God, I'd believe it too. It wasn't like Abraham was in a city filled with people who could have done such a thing. So I don't see where faith would have had anything to do with it. I don't see where Abraham would have any choice other than to believe that God was indeed God. It wasn't a matter of faith, but a matter of proof, the proof being a voice that came from nowhere, from no human being. &
Well Lulapilgrim if I read that passage of Pauls for myself, I wouldn't say that the meaning that you gave it was the one that I'd find in it. I would say that Paul was saying that faith wasn't enough.. One can hope but hope isn't always fulfilled. Which is what I would see in his words "the evidence of things that appear not". i don't see it as things that we can't see. However do I take things literally, as they are written and don't try to gues
In all the places that I've read your remarks KFC, never once have I read you say "I don't know. Ask God for the answers." You have always sought to explaiin the mind of God and what the meaining of Gods words are. When you are backed into a corner, you are done, and dismiss the other person like a queen dismisses a lowly subject with a wave of her hand and a "I told you what it meant." Or you run away and refuse to explain anything . You are the grandest
Faith KFC? Faith is simply belief without proof. Abraham had proof. God spoke to him, in a voice, that he heard, and he told him who he was, KFC. It was to Abrahan's credit that he knew and understood that the voice was telling him the truth. It is not as you put it, a matter of simple faith. However now a days, we'd tell him that he needed to see a psychiatrist, because those that hear voices, are nuts. Good thing that Abraham wasn't born in
"And God said " Let us make man in our image after our likeness" Now that's an interesting bit of scripture. Care to explain KFC, just who God was speaking to when God said "let US make man in OUR image after OUR likeness"?
Is it not possible do you think, that the "tabernacle" that you mention is the body of man? That the erecting of a building called the "tabernacle" was simply a physical reminder of the "true tabernacle" for the Hebrews? A place that when they entered it for worship they would be reminded of the connection between themselves and God, and served to focus their attention upon that fact? Yes I am aware of death, and "the death", and that there is
What is there that you think needs clarification? When God indicates that God's spirit can not dwell in man for more than 120 years, it is a definate indication that God's spirit does dwell in man, even if for a short period of time. When God's spirit no longer dwells in man, man dies.
"Just like the Church, the Temple as a building was important. We find the Bible uses the the word "temple" in many ways always signifying a place where GOd dwells. The Temple was the building that stood in Jerusalem until 70AD. Almighty God did dwell in the Old Covenant Temple until the Temple Veil was rent from top to bottom at the moment of Christ's death on the Cross." I must disagree with you Lulapilgrim. God does not dwell in buildings, not temple b
Interesting explanation Lulapilgrim. However, please explain the meaning of the following and how you feel it relates to the "church": Matthew 23 verses 16-22 "Woe to you, blind guides, who say, "Whoever swears by the temple, it is nothing; but whoever swears by the gold of the temple, he is bound." You blind fools! for which is greater, the gold, or the temple which sanctifies the gold? "And whoever swears by the altar, it is nothing; b
Interesting how you cited that: "We know that Christ's truths was to be taught until the end of the world, and that was accomplished by the Apostles and anointing or ordaining other fit men, by the laying on of hands, they would be the "dispensers of the m,ysteries of Christ." 1Cor. 4:1." Tell me what do you think the "mysteries" of Christ were? The obeying of the commandments were not a mystery, the hebrews already knew about those. Is it the resurrection? I
Lulapilgrim, Jesus would not have used the word "church". The word was not in existance at the time of Jesus. If anything at all he would have used the word "temple". What ever the original word was it's meaning was not "church", but was translated to it in order to give the new fledgling church some semblance of authority. It is the same with the passage concerning Peter. I would hazard a guess and say the original word that was translated to "church" wa
All the disciples had to do was repeat verbatim that which they heard. They did not do this. Wisdom, understanding, counsel, fortitude, knowledge, piety and fear of the Lord does not make a difference nor is it a neccesity in order to repeat that which one has heard. All that is necessary is to be able to recall the words. There was no need for them to understand them first before speaking of them. Jesus said "the holy spirit will teach you, and
"Note I used a small "l" in the word light." I wasn't speaking of the small "I" in light, I was speaking of the "I" in "I" am the light, the truth and the way. 'Yes, it is necessary to have a teacher. No man is an island. We are created needing one another...Gold made us social biengs, it's just that we need CHrist as Our only King and Teacher and thus His teachinhgs by which to live.' No it isn't necessary. We assume that "no man is an islan
"Christ who said, I am the Light , the Truth and the Way. Yes, Jesus said this, notice if you will the use of his word "I". In no way does this statement denote "church". And how odd is it not, that Paul received his message and teachings directly from Jesus, so he says, but yet he relegates others to having to learn of this through teachers, and the church, quite unlike himself. I am very much reminded of the actions of the Pharisees and Scribes&nb
Interesting Lulapilgrim, I'm learning a great deal about your religion and I thank you for the lesson. "God is Pure Light and Infinite Wisdom...and after the fall of our first parents, God promised a Redeemer. His revealed holy religion Biblical Judaism fulfilled through, with and in Christ become Christianity is the only light in the world. From this we can understand the necessity of true religion, in which we give praise, thanks and worship in the way He pr
I would have to say that the "good news" of Jesus is not that it is possible, for there have been those who have proved that it is, but that Jesus showed to mankind the specific steps that are necessary in order to walk with God and leave this world. No one before Jesus had done this. In other words the "secret" was kept onto themselves. Now I'm not saying that the secret kept by those before was kept secret out of malice or a lack of compassion, but because mankind was not
Thanks for the explanation Lulapilgrim. I have to agree that sinners can not assume that they are saved, it's that very assumption that is their downfall. It's the "lazy mans" way to salvation, no effort required. I realize that there were some through out the OT who walked with God and disappeared from the earth. It is therefore reasonable to think that it is possible for all to do this thing if they but make the effort and choice to do so. I have issu
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