The Elemental all-purpose mega thread

By on September 17, 2010 3:59:28 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Frogboy

Join Date 03/2001
+1470

I'm putting up this thread as a way for us to just generally talk about the game, brain storm ideas for the future, etc.

So here's my stream of consciousness to get it started:

What I'd like to see happen is for Elemental: War of Magic to continue to be refined with its existing game mechanics largely intact other than the change to the mana system and UI update scheduled for v1.1.

Beyond that, the evolution of the Elemental TBS would be delivered via expansions, sequels, etc. like every other traditional game. This way, we can introduce pretty substantial gameplay changes without people feeling like the War of Magic version is some sort of test tube of game design experimentation.

For brevity, call these A, B, C where A is Elemental: War of Magic and B and C are some sort of future expansions.  B would be free to everyone and C would be free to those who own the game by September 30th.

So with A, the game mechanics revolve around exploring the world, exploiting world resources, expanding your control, and exterminating enemies. A will evolve as we go to 1.1 with more techs and improvements that let players convert 1 resource that they have a lot in to one they are lacking in. Spells will draw from a global mana pool and the UI will be cleaned up and content across the board expanded on. For good or bad, minus bugs, A is what we originally conceived of for War of Magic and it should rise or fall based on that.

B will be a new Elemental title (an expansion pack ala GalCiv II: Dark Avatar). It is important that B come out sooner rather than later. Users who like/enjoy A can stick with A but users who find the combat in Elemental too simplistic or are unsatsified with some other core game element will hopefully have much of this addressed in B.

C will also be a new Elemental title (ala GalCiv II: Twilight of the Arnor). C involves more wholesale gameplay changes and would take quite a bit longer to come out.  A and B would continue to be supported (just like we did with GalCiv and Sins) but I would picture C adding a great deal more depth to the overall game across the board.    

So as we move forward, when people say "I think something should be like this" we will think about those requests and put them either in the A, B, or C buckets.

So for example, a user commented today that the combat should support flanking and there should be taxes and that there should be easy ways to convert resources and such.  If we concluded that this is a direction we'd want to take the game into, it would go into the C bucket.  It's way too radical for A, not doable for B but would be doable for C.

On the other hand, having the tactical battles eliminate "action points" but instead go with initiative on a per unit basis is too much for A (that's not the system we had in mind for War of Magic) but is something we would do for B.

And so on.

So feel free to use this thread to talk about pretty much anything you want. It's just a back and forth with us.

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September 17, 2010 4:14:05 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting ,
C would be free to those who own the game by September 30th.


What I'd like to see happen is for Elemental: War of Magic to continue to be refined with its existing game mechanics largely intact other than the change to the mana system and UI update scheduled for v1.1.

 

This is something you guys need to decide fast and stick to the decision. Last week you said people that owned the game by the time of 1.3 (or something like that), either way I'm pretty sure this is something that is best decided quick and whatever you do don't change your mind.

So, just to get this straight. Last week you said you were going to fine tune the game till 1.3 and call that the vanilla version, making the demo out of it.

What you are saying now is that this (1.3) would be in fact a new expansion, a free one to everyone even people who just buy only the vanilla game.

 

I don't see what is the benefit. Say someone reads about Elemental 1 year from now and buys the vanilla version. His game automatically updates to the expansion. When he starts playing he sees no traces of the vanilla game. This can be very confusing.

 

In short, what is the point of calling it an expansion instead of just a big huge "change it all" patch. I mean, anyone buying the game after the patch/expansion wouldn't even know what the game was like before anyway and if you aren't going to charge anyone for it, again, what is the point.

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September 17, 2010 4:17:34 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

This is something you guys need to decide fast and stick to the decision. Last week you said people that owned the game by the time of 1.3 (or something like that), either way I'm pretty sure this is something that is best decided quick and whatever you do don't change your mind.

Initially the plan was to make the *first* expansion free to people who owned the game by 1.3. Now it's just free period.

1.1/Sep30 is for the second one after. Buy sooner, get more free stuff later.

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September 17, 2010 4:18:17 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

While personally, I'm in favour of the "wargame" approach to tactical battles, I do understand the concept of milestones and creating a game that is fun and working - instead of one that includes every possible daydream. =P   (incidentially, I wrote one of the posts on flanking but there are others)

On a grand scale, I consider colour far more important. The current magic system is just too drab and samey. It doesn't even have to be a complete rewrite but the different schools should clearly reflect a certain style, such as Life magic being all protecty and Death doind dastardly things to your enemy. (or yourself if you roll a fumble...)

 

Some design choices also feel very arbitrary, such as not being able to have a unit with four guys unless you research how to do such a thing at all.
Seriously. Hey, you four over there! You're a unit now, got that? Research done. =P

IMO you should always be able to build such a unit but making it fight effectively would be the result of research.
A very simplistic way only requiring very local changes: larger units cannot gain experience (or only very slowly) until you research the appropriate tech.
And 8 man squads cannot be built as veterans until you research the 8 man squad tech.

So even with a low-tech approach, you could slowly level up your large units and they would eventually become veterans. Only with far more painful trial and error (slower XP gain) than troops that use a proper command structure, seargants, and what have you. Military technology...

 

It's easy to ask for AI improvements but for that to happen, the game has to settle down a bit with the balancing more or less in place.

Which expansion ends up being the Game To End All Games... I seriously don't care.

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September 17, 2010 4:18:56 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Good stuff!

I say just keep doing what you do! Keep addign stuff to what we have now and later on hit us with the two expansions!

To be honest all i need is magic improved and Ai improved. Anything else is just a bonus for me personally.

Also maybe for multiplayer it would be cool to be able to do me and a friend vs 2 AI opponents?

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September 17, 2010 4:24:09 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting ,

  and improvements that let players convert 1 resource that they have a lot in to one they are lacking in. Spells will draw from a global mana pool and the UI will be cleaned up and content across the board expanded on.


On the other hand, having the tactical battles eliminate "action points" but instead go with initiative on a per unit basis is too much for A (that's not the system we had in mind for War of Magic) but is something we would do for B.

And so on.

So feel free to use this thread to talk about pretty much anything you want. It's just a back and forth with us.

 

First Page!  Ok couldn't resist that.  Ok now onto my comments.

 

These are all excellent ideas.  Having something to convert my 2000 extra materials would be awesome.

I like the initiative idea because currently, Mana + aoe spell + imbued champion + attacking first = win

The biggest fundamental new statistic that myself and LOTS of other posters thinks the game needs is some type of magical resistance. Otherwise right now I tend to steamroll the AI by researching the first direct damage spell then onto the first AOE spell, for me this is usually Infernal, then just always initiate the attack where I let my imbued champions cast unlimited range spells and/or AOE.  If nothing else put some more range constraints on the spells.  Unlimited range spells are only fun for so long when you realize the enemy stack only had 1-2 turns to try and move 2 squares ahead.

Also when you give your champions bows combined with some mana they seem to be unstoppable.  The AI doesn't seem to know how to counter ranged combat very well, which typically is to create some very fast moving, 4 squares at a time, troops and get in the face of the casters/archers.  AKA cavalry. Once the mounted troops close on the archers, it's usually bye bye archers. Right now I don't see that.

So please consider some type of balance to the magic system for bucket B or at least have the AI cast a few more spells and Im not counting the Empire Spy because that guy was overpowered to begin with.

Finally, thanks so much for the great game. There is no question you and your team are visionaries in game development, just consider the balance aspect as well.  Rock, paper, scissors always comes to mind. Although my kids tend to use "tornado" and how can I argue with that.

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September 17, 2010 4:32:57 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting ,

B will be a new Elemental title (an expansion pack ala GalCiv II: Dark Avatar). It is important that B come out sooner rather than later. Users who like/enjoy A can stick with A but users who find the combat in Elemental too simplistic or are unsatsified with some other core game element will hopefully have much of this addressed in B.

So... Elemental's combat is going to suck for another year?

I feel like I've just been told that you're releasing the game you were supposed to release two years from now and I can expect it then.

How about instead of free expansions you offer no-questions-asked refunds regardless of where the game was purchased?  I bought from Amazon, for instance, and would really prefer my money back instead of more IOU promises.

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September 17, 2010 4:33:16 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting ,
I'm putting up this thread as a way for us to just generally talk about the game, brain storm ideas for the future, etc.

A is Elemental: War of Magic

B will be Elemental: The Small/Fast Expansion.

C will be Elemental: Big Expansion #1.

So feel free to use this thread to talk about pretty much anything you want. It's just a back and forth with us.

Good to know.

Are the plans for Time off for modding andAPI and scripting release still on track?  I can't wait to get my hands on Elementals guts and re-arange them via script.

Sammual

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September 17, 2010 4:39:27 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting lord ebonstone,


So... Elemental's combat is going to suck for another year?

 

From what I understood this expansion/megapatch would be for around November or so.

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September 17, 2010 4:41:54 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I don't think I would be a fan of converting materials, gold, crystals and such.  If you need one of them, forge a trade agreement and do it that way.  I would be more in line with having caravans be able to select what kind of trade is going on with foreign cities.  I send a caravan to city and give gold for metal.  I send caravan b to a different city and get crystals for metal.  Don't think I like the switching back and forth at will--even if there is a conversion loss.

 

Global Mana Pool--is the idea the person that controls the crystals controls that percentage of the Global Mana Pool.

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September 17, 2010 4:44:14 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Sounds like a good approach.  My only concern is if B and C become all or nothing type options.  For example, if a user really wants the more advanced tactical combat but doesn't want the rest of the game affected.  Maybe as toggles on the option screen?  Obviously I have no idea how feasible this is   But just looking at the boards and my own game play, I'm not the only one who likes parts of elemental as they are and think those only need minor tweaks, but other parts need overhauls.

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September 17, 2010 4:44:52 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting kaiapo,

From what I understood this expansion/megapatch would be for around November or so.

Quoting frogboy,

B will be a new Elemental title (an expansion pack ala GalCiv II: Dark Avatar). It is important that B come out sooner rather than later. Users who like/enjoy A can stick with A but users who find the combat in Elemental too simplistic
or are unsatsified with some other core game element will hopefully have much of this addressed in B.

Dark Avatar was released a year after GalCiv2.

 

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September 17, 2010 4:46:05 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Get an ai able to, if not threaten the player, at least put up a fight first.

Either that or provide hotseat MP so one can test the gameplay against oneself.

Until the ai is able to provide some opposition or strategies tested agaisnt oneself, game balance will be very hard to check.

So: Code the ai.

By doing so you'll realise that researching exclusively the summons spells and using your sovereign and her 7 summoned monsters alone you can beat all the civs on the map pretty fast, then you can address the issue: Nerf the spells, or teach the ai to use them?

If you make changes to the mechanics without having players to test them against intelligent opponents, you'll just waste your energy.

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September 17, 2010 4:55:25 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Sounds like a solid conceptual plan Frogboy. And I greatly appreciate the free expansions, I know you guys didn't have to do that. I must admit that I'm particularly looking forward to version "C", I always tend to prefer more complexity and depth in my gameplay.

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September 17, 2010 4:58:32 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting ,


What I'd like to see happen is for Elemental: War of Magic to continue to be refined with its existing game mechanics largely intact other than the change to the mana system and UI update scheduled for v1.1.

...

C will also be a new Elemental title (ala GalCiv II: Twilight of the Arnor). C involves more wholesale gameplay changes and would take quite a bit longer to come out.  A and B would continue to be supported (just like we did with GalCiv and Sins) but I would picture C adding a great deal more depth to the overall game across the board.    

...
So for example, a user commented today that the combat should support flanking and there should be taxes and that there should be easy ways to convert resources and such.  If we concluded that this is a direction we'd want to take the game into, it would go into the C bucket.  It's way too radical for A, not doable for B but would be doable for C.

On the other hand, having the tactical battles eliminate "action points" but instead go with initiative on a per unit basis is too much for A (that's not the system we had in mind for War of Magic) but is something we would do for B. 

 

What kind of timeframe are we looking at for this C title? How feasible is it for modders to make extensive changes to the game's mechanics to make their own "C-type" version with the currently available tools?

 

Basically, I'm not in any way satisfied with the game as it's shaping up right now, and I'm wondering whether I need to totally shelve it and wait until some decent expansions or community mods come out, or if I should start investing time & energy in learning the mod tools so I can get the sort of gameplay I desire in a possibly sooner timeframe.....

 

I'd rather not get stuck playing Dominions III for my fantasy strategy fix and Total War mods for my fantasy tactical fix for all eternity.

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September 17, 2010 4:59:52 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

A couple of ideas for the various parts:

 

Part A (Elemental: War of Magic), could do with a bit more focus on world restoration/adventuring heroes/sovereign. Think of this as an "early" age, when the channelers were just emerging and are putting together struggling kingdoms. The idea here is to have more RPG elements, and focus more on having strong heroes/sovereign carry the weight rather than have massive armies (this can be an excuse for the more simplistic combat style). City building should be hard (perhaps making pioneers cost much higher), the focus would be in searching the world for elemental shards (which should be rare and never spawned near your starting point), and there should be more emphasis on taking control of them. Perhaps add some type of strong guardian monster groups (attracted to its power) to defend the shards, which you have to defeat before you can claim it. Then once claimed, the shards can generate a series of bonuses that would make a faction with one be much stronger than one without (personally I think the current bonus to spell damage just breaks the combat balance). This can also serve as a mechanic for a smaller kingdom to fight against a much bigger one. It also puts a lot more emphasis on fighting over them, and thus fitting of the "War of Magic" title. Ideally there should be more magic involve overall, such as global spells and enchantment, which I hope to see once we get global mana. Just to be clear, I'm not expecting this from v1.1, but this should be the ultimate goal of the A path at the end of the Elemental development cycle as a whole.

 

Part B then would focus on what happens afterward. Think of this as a more "middle" age, where magic isn't quite as rare and thus not as dominant. Shift the focus away from having powerful heroes by making them rarer and more expensive, then introduce larger and stronger armies by adding better training facilities, increase squad sizes, and more advance combat strategies. Thus, you could push most of the combat update into part B. You can relax the bonus you get from shards by adding some buildings that mimics the shard bonus so as to dilute its power, this could serve as an update to the civics tree (along with some prestige buildings to speed up city growth so that you can train bigger armies). At this point we want a more balanced focus between army building and hero building. Heroes should become less as super combatants, and more as army leaders. For example, they should develop skills to let them command more armies and bringing larger men into battle (update to the adventuring tree). It's important not to go too far and make them useless in combat though, they should still be able to help your army out if they want. More warfare tech is a no brainer for this part, but there should be more emphasis on choices in unit design, perhaps also adding more available magical equipments (magic tree update). You could also add some diplomacy techs that puts those diplomacy capital to some use as a diplomacy update. Perhaps put more emphasis on Kingdom/Empire hostility to drive the action. Don't get me wrong though, it shouldn't be about a bunch of mundane guys running around with sticks and more about magically enchanted armies competing for dominance.

 

Part C would then be the other end of the spectrum. Think of this as a late age, where heroes are very rare and you really have to rely on large armies. Magic is now common place, so you can make large armies of magic wielders shooting fireballs, flying knights and valkyries, etc. Just go crazy with your imagination here and don't hold back. Perhaps this part can heavily expand on summoning magic, demon pacts, undeads, animals, and of course magical heroes (since they are so rare now). This could also be the chance to really separate the various spell books and factions, make them interesting and varied. Basically your MoM fanatic's wetdream.

 

 

With this approach, all three parts will have their own charm. If you only like one type you can play that, and you can switch to another if you get bored. This adds replay value and the game will probably get played to death and back as a result. I wish you guys the best of luck.

 

 

I began writing this before there were any replies to the thread, so I apologize if I haven't read any suggestion above me.

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September 17, 2010 5:03:30 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Same as I have asked all along.

Combat - 4 types of damage. Piercing, cutting, blunt and magic and the accompanying saves.

Resources - we need lots and lots of variety here.More than pumpkins, wheat and bees. How about cattle, fish, wild game, diamonds, bamboo etc etc etc.

Mounts - more variety and interaction.A mount that fights too, a warhorse that tramples and or bites/kicks. a Warg that bites ala LoTR.

Uniqueness to each faction - tech trees, research, magic, personality.

Dynasty system - I could write a 10 page essay if you'd like.

Naval combat - ship to ship fighting in the tactical sense and maybe boarding actions.

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September 17, 2010 5:09:19 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

One of the thing I would really like in A is a more flexible ability system. And all it would take are more XML tags, as I've suggested in the Elemental Ideas post previously. Tags with conditions, tags with (relatively simple) combat triggers, etc. There's a lot to be done here.

Also, please include the possibility of choosing an ability at level up; you can count on me to flesh out the ability trees if the XMLs are good enough for this.

B should have at least some position/motion dependent events in tactical battles. Zones of control/attacks of opportunity, something like that. Also, tactical battle square-dependent bonus (and not strategic battle-dependent bonus).

In C, you could go fo an AoW-2/Total War inspired line of sight/fortification system (you don't have to copy them, of course, but it's a lot more fun than "+2 to defense if you have a Hedge Wall".

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September 17, 2010 5:10:09 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Champions

Make Champions generally more interesting.

Special tree that you could assign points on when leveling up, enabling specialization.

Passive XP gains for non-combatant specs.

Access to cool abilities through said talent trees.

My detailed champion ideas can be found here http://forums.elementalgame.com/388600

Game Mechanics

In general I really like the mechanics that Elemental brings to the table, but it feels like these mechanics aren’t working together enough to provide immersion and a sense of cohesiveness throughout the game (this is of course my opinion).

These systems which make up Elemental are the following: Research, Magic, Dynasty, Combat/Units, Diplomacy, Adventure, Post-Cataclysm World.

I probably missed some, but I would like to see a way to tie all these awesome concepts together and form a web that could be filled with many interesting options. Of course I have several ideas I’ve posted already but I’ll repost them here one last time just in case. So here are some examples of how I would relate these concepts/features to one another:

 

Arcane knowledge (Learning Spells/Magic):   

At the moment this to me feels like it could use something else. You learn a spell and thats, then you learn another and another. You also most probably gotta wait to use them till combat, but that’s not my point. My gripe lies with the Learning system itself and hopefully you will understand what I'm saying with my examples.

Idea 1:

To improve upon the Arcane knowledge system I propose having a counter that adds up all the Arcane Knowledge you've earned up to your current turn. Eg, you are gaining 5 knowledge per turn and you’re in turn 10. This counter would be at 50. What is the purpose of this counter? With this you could add another layer to knowledge system and you could use this counter to do multiple cool things. This counter could also be used with the research points to create cool effects and bonuses!

Example 1:

When this counter reaches 50 points, you could gain the chance to cast a free enchantment in a city that lasts X turns. Your nation is increasing its magical knowledge and they found a way to cast a free spell yay!

In this example I connected the Arcane Knowledge to our cities and it's not affecting the magic research, it’s just a counter that adds a possible cool bonus.

Example 2:

The counter reaches 50 points just like above but instead of a free city enchant, you could get a free unit enchant and effectively add a relation between arcane knowledge and units!

Another idea that came to mind using said system was making the actual number required to obtain this bonus dependant on your total cities. For example, if you have 1 city then you would get your first bonus at say 35 points, but if you have 5 cities then the first bonus would be at say 140 (made up these numbers out of thin air). This would help alleviate the problem that small kingdoms that don’t spam cities suffer against bigger kingdoms that do the opposite.

 

Dynasty

You could choose a city where to raise your kids (making them interactive since they are a baby) and for example if that city had an ice shard they could have an affinity towards ice. This in turn could increase their resistances to ice, or spell power with ice. Here we linked the dynasty to the cities!

 

Combat/Units

Every fight you win could means something because you could earn points for winning fights, stored in a counter similar to the Magic and research idea. This counter could be somewhat similar to Civilizations 4 Great General counter but it could have different effects. It could spawn a great warrior every certain points. Or maybe every X xp points your warriors become inspired (or bloodthirsty) and gain morale/combat bonuses? There could also be special monuments that could be placed in a city that did something cool.

 

 

 

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September 17, 2010 5:12:58 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Robert Hentschke,

Some design choices also feel very arbitrary, such as not being able to have a unit with four guys unless you research how to do such a thing at all.
Seriously. Hey, you four over there! You're a unit now, got that? Research done. =P

This. And I'm aware I'm being insistent on this point but I really can't understand where things like this come from.

Research to unlock heroes...

Research to unlock dungeons...

Research to make monsters pop...

Research to have soldiers travel in groups...

Research to learn how to raze a city...

 

I mean, how hard can it be? Just rape the women and burn everything down, I'd guess. How did Attila do? I don't think he asked scholars.

Now, I wouldn't raze cities anyway but I really am baffled by all this and by the fact that most players seem to be ok with what "research" means in Elemental  .  Seriously, what happened? I hate to sound so negative but it all seems such a wasted opportunity to me.

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September 17, 2010 5:15:54 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I've had far too little sleep to write something really meaningful, so ill provide a nice, simple bullet list...

  • expand the existing array of quests, and quest capabilities
  • improve / expand the modding tools at our disposal
    • what would take me 10 minutes in the TES editor took me 1 hour last night
    • provide simple left-click placement of already inserted objects in the modding environment

this modding community is a vital asset to EWoM... some exceptionally talented folks!!

and again, thanks for all your own (Stardock) collective hard work and diligence...

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September 17, 2010 5:25:28 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

OK Here are some of the stuff I would like to see .  This is from my Post Here: http://forums.elementalgame.com/394749 

Im just going to hit some points on it, Read from the sorce post..  

 

I was really dispointed in the sovereign customization... I was looking forwad to making Elemental Themed Sovereigns ...

 

A: 

Sovereign,Advantages

 

Spell Knowledge lets you start with some  spells from that element.   

 

Elemental Affinity ,  Acts like one elemental shard of that type: Gain + 1 Mana a turn for each Shard of this type  , Requires base spell book of same type. 

 

Pure Soul:  Your connection to the world is strong you regenerate one mana per combat turn and one extra mana per turn. 

Cost 10

 

Sovereigns Bond:  You have a great bond with the land, your bond calls upon  the strength  of the land it self and  you can channel spells to any combat that happens in your domain.  

+ 5 hit points + 5 Essence  +1 Mana Regain 

You are able to cast spells in any combat that happens with in your domain. 

If you out of your territory you suffer -5 hit points  -5 Essence, Lose the Mana Regain bonus and can no longer channel spells to distant combats. 

Cost 20

 

Mana Control:  Caster uses 20% less mana to cast spells.  

Cost 5     ( dose not stack With any other  Mana Control skills) 

 

Fast caster - Spells take 50% less Ap to cast 

5 points can not take Slow Caster 

 

Sovereign,Disadvantages

 

Elemental Weakness ,  Take 10% more damage form this Elemental Type,  Get  50% of the shard bonus for this Elemental Shards  Get .5 mana Per shard of this type: 

 

Poor Mana Control:  Caster uses 25% more mana to cast spells.  

Cost:-5     ( dose not stack With any other  Mana Control skills) 

 

Slow Caster - Spells take 50% More Ap to cast 
-5 points can not take Fast Caster 

 

Poor Concentration : You Control of spells is not perfect when rushed , Tactical Spells do -10% less damage.. 

-3 points  Can not take War Caster

 

Tongue Tied:  25% more expensive  equipment  25%more for hiring champions  - chance for Marriage acceptance. 

-3 points can not take Silver Tongue

 

Poor: Start with 25 Gold Less  (Can only take one Start Money Trait) 

Cost : -1 (Can only take one Start Money Trait)

 

Customization - Champions - Sovereigns - Skills 

Would Like to have  a Skill Tree: Set form to pick from at Creation: 

Such as:   Skill picks at every 2 Levels: 2,4,6,8,10,12,14,16,18,20,...ect...

Skills unlock at certain Levels, you get to pick one every so many levels. 

Most skills require the previous one in that skill family

 

Warrior Ethos: You are a natural born warrior, Skills in combat come naturally to you. 

Skills: 

 

Level 1: acquired  at Lvl 2 

Combat Stances, Block, Heavy Strike, Pain Tolerance, Defense Training, Attack Training, Enemy Weakness Humanoid, Fent  

Level 2: acquired at Lvl 8

Improved Combat Stances, Block and Counter, Crippling Strike, Improved Pain Tolerance, Imporved Defense Training, Imporved Attack Training, Enemy Weakness Beast, Impoved Fent

Level 3: acquired at Lvl 16 

Advanced Combat Stances,  Preemptive Strike, Devastaing Strike,  Advanced Pain Tolerance, Advanced Defense Training, Advanced Attack Training, Enemy Weakness Magical, Advanced Fent 

Level 4: acquired at Lvl 24 

Legendary Combat Stances,  Preemptive Strike Block and Counter, Legendary Strike, Legendary Pain Tolerance,  Legendary Defense Training,  Legendary Attack Training, Legendary Enemy Weekness, Legendary Fent

http://forums.elementalgame.com/394749 <--- Check here if You want to read about each skill about half way down the post. 

 

Factions -  Really need more to make them feel more unique 

 

Ancient Maps: These Maps have been handed down the generations  ( shows entire map and the resources at the start of the game) 

Cost: 15 

 

Ancient Archives XXXXtech:   Start with level 2 in this tech.  (XXXTech is any tech tree) 

Cost:5

 

Stunted Advancement XXXXtech:  Start at Level -1 in this tech. 

Cost - 3

 

Good Eyes:  All units, city's have + 1 sight range 

Cost: 3

 

Poor Eye sight: All units, city's have -1 sight range: 

Cost:-3

 

Subterranean: Your race survived by sheltering underground during the cataclysm:  +25 Def for defenders in your towns, + 5 Hits . After 10 turns huts and houses are moved underground allowing you to build over them.   

Cost: 10 

 

B or C:  

I would like to see Ships get more development:  Say a base type and let us add stuff to them,   Better sails,  Ballista, Catapults, Or Archers  Have each size get more # of Weapons.   So a Schooner could only have only one weapon, while a Warship can carry six catapults. 

 

Schooner : Fast small armed  scout:    Can cary one Unit(up to a squad) 

Not sure on cost:

 

Transport: Carries Units 

 

Brigantine: An armed warship mounts 3x weapons can carry 4 units 

 

Warship: Heavy warship: Mounts 6x weapons can carry 6 units 

 

Merchant Ship : Acts like a caravan has to have a harbor at each city But with 4x the bonus ( since it dose not make roads) 

 

Flying Units---  

Ok So we have dragons.... that cant fly..... What the hell......  Are the wings for cooling off and not flight? 

 

Would like to see 

Pegasus  ... 

Wyvern 

Griffons 

ect...

Plz...... Lol wanted mounted Archers on flying horses >.> 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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September 17, 2010 6:16:42 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Ok, here is an idea that would take you through the stages of the sovereign.  Right now the Sovs are a bit too squishy. You don't want to take them too far into combat so then end up just being taxis due to the Organized talent, which I am glad to see disappear.

However, there should be a natural progression of the sovereign as a leader.  In game A he/she wanders around helping out casting spells here swinging the occasional sword.

In game B he/she starts venturing out less and less, giving him bonuses to magic cast in his own territory

Finally in game C he/she doesn't leave his home city at all.

During these phases he/she continues to level by benefiting from the Champions victories more and more.

In game C, since the sovereign has evolved into a king and each level he can get a choice of talents. Nothing benefiting combat statistics but each level would offer choices of 

+1 tech

+1 arcane

+1 gildar

More defense or offense for heroes etc.

It would be all about becoming the true leader by building up the Champions more and more without the sovereign ever leaving the "castle" except maybe to continue recruiting more Champions.

 

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September 17, 2010 6:46:19 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

To add on to my earlier idea about the early/middle/late age thing here:

 

Early age (part A), could have the resource system now, where the big focus is on discovering and claiming resources and have it drive your kingdom/empire. It is a system that encourages exploration, and fits the adventuring theme.

 

Middle age (part B ), should shift away a bit by making wild resources rarer or produce less (they are running dry) and by having more buildings that generate straight income. Like a farm that generates +1 food, and better buildings that produce mats/iron/crystal/tech/arcane that can be build in all cities. You can use the increased availability of magic to explain these improvements. A simple tax system can be used to generate Gildar. This more stabilized economy will help people plan out their strategy more, as they can always depend on set incomes. This is needed when we start shifting away from heroes and into a more normal unit based system. Any resources you find will just be a nice extra, but not completely needed. Along with this, you should probably implementing a maintenance system to control empire size (say corruption). You could also add more civil heroes with bad combat stats (administrator/farmer/miner) to help manage cities, thus explaining the rarity of combat heroes (less adventurers, more administrators).

 

Late age (part C), is again the other end of the spectrum. Resources are really scarce now (all exploited) and you really have to build everything. Basically your economy is ran entirely through city construction. You choose how to build your cities, and what to build in them. This allows players to develop their kingdom/empire the way they want to without worrying about whether they will find that resource node. Ideally, the cities should be much more specialized for this. Have an academic city (tech bonus on level) be able to build large research centers, commercial cities (Gildar bonus) be able to build banks, etc. Although I'd love it if this kind of system was also present in some form in part B. You can, again, go wild with this. For example: Level 3+ Dungeon (monster spawn option) might be buried under ground, Level 5 Magic cities might be floating in the sky and can only be taken over by flying units... like I said, go nuts and don't hold back.

 

Again, a little for everyone.

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September 17, 2010 6:55:21 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting kryo,

This is something you guys need to decide fast and stick to the decision. Last week you said people that owned the game by the time of 1.3 (or something like that), either way I'm pretty sure this is something that is best decided quick and whatever you do don't change your mind.
Initially the plan was to make the *first* expansion free to people who owned the game by 1.3. Now it's just free period.

1.1/Sep30 is for the second one after. Buy sooner, get more free stuff later.



NOT true.  Here is a quote from Frogboy in another thread just a few DAYS ago.

Frogboy wrote:

Beyond v1.1, the first free expansion pack will have a new combat system, new tactical battle system, book 2, and a host of other things but that won't happen until Thanksigiving time frame.

The second expansion pack, next year, is also planned to be free for users who own the game before v1.1 is released (first expansion free for all, second free to those who were with us from before v1.1).



The more I follow the evolution of this game post-release, the less impressed I get. 

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September 17, 2010 7:01:34 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Hmm.  I can't figure out how to edit my reply.  me = board newb.  That first sentence after the Frogboy quote SHOULD be part of the quote itself.  Must have made a boo-boo.  Anyway, it occurred to me after posting this, that perhaps the initial IN-HOUSE plan was what Kryo states it to be, but what Frogboy wrote on the forums about how "2nd exp. will be free to customers [y]" just a couple days ago doesn't quite sync up with what he's saying in this thread.

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