OMG Please devs read.

How do you fix problems without changing mechanics? I mean I agree with many problems you are describing, but you cannot both ask them to not touch stuff and ask them to change stuff! Does not compute.

Sounds like you have an install issue.

Really though, if a game gets you this rattled......

Yikes.  I have actually been much...much happier with each patch that has come.

How can i have an install issue when it is a new install?

Core mechanics vs video problems....deadlined sovs and no hp versus sideways spells and arrows...big difference

What ? I shouldnt be playing this game? I am a gamer i play instead of watching tv or talking on facebook. I played WOW rift ruins star wars

diablo1-3 starcraft torchlight civ MOO command and conquer alpha centauri disciples  war of the rings warlords battlecry1602 ad sins galciv  lords of the realm age of empires deadlock age of empires and those are just the cds that i can see. If i played golf and they started removing holes on the back nine and telling me i had to play with only a nine iron and two balls, dont you think i should be as bent? Thats what this feels like.

IM not throwing crap around but I feel that i should share my views on this. Sorry if you are offended.

And yes MHANTRA i am going right back and load up and start playing again......

Stardock continues to change a game that's still in beta. Such a tragedy.

Now it's a little hard. You have to think before you do stuff. 

It's like a bus from the orphanage crashed into a truck carrying only the cutest kittens. Send for help!

Edit: To further elaborate.  The same people who are responsible for the design of the game you're enjoying so much are the ones making changes to that design.  Have a little faith that if they could make FE fun, they can improve that design in the next 4 months and fix bugs and polish everything up.

If your sovereign starts withnegative hp there is a problem.

....without changing game mechanics?

I have to disagree with you. Every patch has been better and better in my opinion and has been addressing player concerns. Stats were pointless and while they were kinda cool in theory, in practice they were interfering with balance. It was nigh impossible to make them of equal value and some of them only affected one secondary stat anyway.

The HP thing seems like a bug. Try reinstalling with the complete all in one download, sometimes patching causes weird issues. Also make sure mods are disabled. Sovereigns should be starting with 20+ HP.

Plus some of those changes he lists are not in the game, at all.

Sorry that every one is hung up on that NOT neg sov hp but really reduced hp and attack and EVERY other attribute. First combat shoot dodge shoot  dodge  attack and i am dead. Really got killed by a stalker on first turn. With a summoned LEVEL ONE???? wolf

Yes i understand stardock is changing a game that is still in beta...we saw that all thru the last game also...after we paid for it and after we had an apology and after we still kept playing it. Now we are playing Elemental 2.0 and i dont want to ride the train down to only playing tarth with low hp and no starting area and a back pack full of neat stuff i cant use. THATS my problem fix stuff thats broke ---stop taking out chunks of game that we have been playing with for years--DS your explanation makes no sense...I know that a warrior needs strength and an archer needs dex....whats's lethal or boon? STATS made up to cover the lack of stats. Several of us posted a thread about missing sov and hero portraits...never once has this been addressed and i have have had it for over 2 months. That is a player concern I CANT see my little super hero so i might as well be playing a text game. THEY could go back to the original beta release and fix the ctds and video errors and lock ups and i would gladly pay 40 bucks today for it. Instead we still have an unstable mess that you cant start a new game from inside the game and everyone has combat turn lock ups. Change gameplay and core mechanics later. We weren't tired of having 10 sovs. We were tired of having to auto complete combat because it locked up.

GLAZ   sovs now have greatly reduced leveling potential....and since upgrades are random...you're fire mage may not fire spec until lvl 6 or 8 or 2...see the problem?

Personal, I agree with some, but patch do not get better or worth, it's just basic, no evil or no good, Patch just basic changed, but is it better? no, but if go bad? no. Some think it's get better, but some rightly think it's not better, so both are right and wrong.

Edit: i though they want to do better than war of magic, but however, it's not any way better than war of magic, it's just lead diffent game, it's like orange and apple now, rather than improve orange over old orange.  War of magic and Fallen Entneess is not same game, even though there may be simlier, but it's now diffent game, it's not better than war of magic, it's diffent than war of magic, rather.....

Basic, you could build almost every kind in city, but this game you don't build every building like a "garden" thier level up in war of magic is make more city gold or mana, or speicl of unit for city, here game that no longer case, insteat they limited building and put few building move to level up and pick that (I think I like old war of magic city builder better, it's far make sence and more fun, though limited one building tyle is new and better, but to building a limited like garden you can't build but had to choice by level up is otherstory and no fun for me. You could had all kind of spell and what to choice to sult your war plan, but in this game, well spell useless more often due to radma and limited, so you not able to use very much like magic of war where I use lot of spell and cheaper than this game, but this game I rare use spell other than heal and haste.

Well... I didn't much like 0.913, but 0.914 is apple pie and cream. 

hound,

the changes you list are all part of the normal beta process.  You have to go to extremes in this process to find what will really work.  This may be the right game for you but you may enjoy it more if you wait until the release when all the balancing and polishing has been done.    

You have valid feedback, but your presentation is definitely lacking.   We want to know what you think and many of us might agree with your points, but at this time, I want Stardock to make mistakes and figure out what will and won't work.

Oh and BTW, they did hire Kael for this game, you know that, right?

Glad to hear it!  Oh, and by the way, I don't think this is the game for you...

Once again we have someone telling a customer that this is not the product they want....it is absolutely amazing how often this comes up on these forums. Oh no we didnt make this game for you...go away..Oh no we dont want you in our community we like playing junk.

My presentation is bad? These guys cant spell taste correctly. Look at your tool tips. I more than understand what is in the beta process...its really funny that torchlight 2 -which i am playing the beta for, doesnt ctd. I would pay for that puppy right now and the beta has been out a week.

All of us here are customers. We want this game but we want it to be fun not a beating. And not new coke in a 1.5 oz can that you have to open with a can opener.

Example....in the new game i just started, On turn 11 a troll army with 133 hp has left the reservation and attacked my city. My sov has 37 hp.

exactly how do i enjoy this beating? The nearby fire elemental has 7 friends now and 129 hp? 2 ignys and 4 fire shrills. The other direction has SARGON---the new dragon which Gilden just walked by twice!!!! Let me try that and see what happens.

And my sov has reduced hp reduced attributes expanded points needed for level up and a talent tree that has me trying to get my death mage to actually have a death spell that does damage.

Stardock is thru with the making mistakes part. we stood with them and i am still playing i just dont want to see another elemental where the designers make decisions that are not in the interest of playing a game.

Example  strength --hit points  damage encumbrance---it has always been that way in games   right?

Now NO strength...but we have boon lethal junior swordman. Why would anyone waste 3 minutes rewriting that for no reason?

Example 5-5 value system for food materials         great idea   why cant we have 4-4 or 5-5? They changed a core mechanic and used it as a stick to beat us with. At least in elemental i just tried to get a mine and maybe a shard. In fe that doesnt matter unless you are on a 4-3 you are screwed. mines and grain and crystal are almost totally irrelevant.Why would a 5-5 starting point be the armegeddon? In Galciv i could improve a planet, here i have magic and cant make a flower grow.

Example new game--take over a rival city 138 turns to build a market...got it down to 24.To build a market that is gonna rip me off so bad that i may as well keep every piece of loot that i find. 10% of value? WHY? So i dont have any money? WHY? Because the devs dont want me to? WHAT?

Example NEW MECHANIC you can enslave other leaders.....well not really we are gonna give them a lobotomy and make sure they are in an unrecoverable spot and ensure that they have to die so they can get gimped up more and you cant do anything about it.....hahahahhahahahaha

Read that last bit over again and tell me someone at stardock doesnt need a beer

yes i know kael works for stardock...civ5 really needs him more   

thanks MHantra   I guess i could go and wait 15 mins for civ5 to load........what a crapshoot that game is

I don't know if they gave people free of this game are a customers, but on otherhand, in my case, if one who did paid like I do for this game, it's sort of mocking customers when customers buy a house and after deal done, and there been broken in house that you not know or think and they said "oh, sorry this house is not for you, too bad, no refund."

Wow... so much raging going on. No offense, but maybe you're the one needing that beer...

A lot of those changes you list seems like a pretty reasonable thing. Perhaps you're not SUPPOSE to be able to kill panthers right off the bat. Maybe they want you to get some ARMORS first. Or maybe you're not suppose to be building your cities so close to troll camps that they'll start chasing you at turn 11. You pick fight with things you can take on, avoid things you can't. Level up a bit, get some better equips, maybe train some TROOPS, and then go kill them. This isn't exactly rocket science.

I'm sorry your sovereign is no longer a walking god right off the bat... if you want him that way, try using some cheats, or learn to mod some values. The reason it's done this way is because they don't want you complaining how the game is so easy when the sovereign just rolls everything by himself. Makes sense to me.

I have a lot of the same feelings as the OP, but I think it's just natural because I've been used to having a mega-sovereign from turn 1 for quite a while now. All of a sudden I can't just go rampaging, leveling and collecting loot and streamrolling the whole map. I also seem to get stuck starting in corners every time I start a new game and there's always some huge army blocking my only way out. It's a little frustrating but I know that these things will be balanced in the future. This is a beta, after all.

kalin---not supposed to be able to kill panthers...then what? decorate my house and watch qvc for 80 turns until i get a troop that can kill something?   get some armor? why i cant wear it without an initiative penalty  troll camps not my city...and it is not a camp it is the big swamp with a GREEN BARRIER around it that i am careful not to touch. pick fights? with what everything is 3x bigger that i am i had two spiders to kill and then hp bunches up to a hundred cant level if i cant fight something  Walking god? I almost always play an archer weak on everything and allow distance to win a fight with ranged attacks. Now initiative is out the window if i wear armor hp is down skill is gone takes forever to level and what am i supposed to be doing while waiting 60 turns for a decent troop? flower arrangements?

Rule number 1 in playing a Beta - don't get attached to today's version, it'll change tomorrow.  I agree that .914 isn't as much fun for me as .913, but telling the Dev's what isn't working for me in the new build is just part of the job of being a beta tester.

It's ok to have opinions & express them in a constructive way.  Just remember the game will ulimately be an expression of the Dev's vision, not ours.

Hopefully the release version will be something that captures the imagination of a majority of gamers who like 4X Fantasy games. 

Stop being so rational and level-headed! 

I agree that the start game is the weakest aspect now of FE and that something needs to be done to fix the game during the fist 30 to 50 turns. Feels like starting in the stone-age and then progressing up. I would much prefer starting in an era close to where the game finishes. I'm liking each beta more and more. It is now a replayable game where-as WoM was a play once game because then you knew exactly what to do next time.

It seems to me that many players approach FE as typical strategy games where the starting phase is to explore and expand aggressively. In FE this is the aspect that gets players into trouble but Stardock should take the feedback on-board that the early game needs some attention. To survive and thrive you need to protect your home city and expand slowly - which is the opposite of most strategy games.

As far as changing the game mechanics are concerned there have been no deletions or corrections that, to me, have weakened the game. If losing a couple of races means we can get unique units, great. Go for it. Even though Carodus was my favourite.

Ok, I will stop pushing buttons, but they were made so available and attractive!

Good post Das--but why did Carrodus have to die for that.....

And i started a new game because THREE umberdoths just wandered in and ate my city

And at the start of a new game i just tried to roll...the old headless sov appeared.......REALLY?

across three computers and 2 OS's and i still have to look at a headless sov?

Aspire AM3450 with win 7-64 and FX 4100 quad core with a Radeon HD 6450 and I still get headless sov?

2 Things.

1) Every update to the beta is not going to make the game better. Many of the updates will make it worse. Thats the point of beta... testing out changes.

2) Your feedback is valuable, when phrased in a constructive way. Complaining about the game isn't as useful as giving a suggestion on how to fix it. Talking in generalized statements like "nobody wants ________" is not helpful since you can't prove that without making a poll. 

I am sure the devs will be happy to hear that you enjoy the game and feel strongly about it, but I don't feel like your post will help them make a better game. Many of the issues you raised are problems that need to be fixed, but again, ideas on how to fix it are more valuable then simply pointing it out.