Frogboy Frogboy

Multiplayer update and brief v1.1 info

Multiplayer update and brief v1.1 info

So this week we’re finishing the process of porting the 1.0x updates to multiplayer. The new combined version will be called v1.09E.  It has a handful of single player game fixes (like the free money from pioneer thing <g>).

After v1.09E, we’ll take a step back to see how people are playing multiplayer and start putting together plans for future improvements in that area based on the number of people in the community playing it.

For myself, I’ve been working on a different branch (v1.1) along with additional content for players of the book (Elemental: Destiny’s Embers).  People have been asking about what the focus of version 1.1 is.

So as some know, the initial release of Elemental was pretty buggy. Obviously, we didn’t intend that and we apologize for the inconvenience and disappointment this caused to our fans and community.  So these updates thus far have been largely about addressing those issues.  Given how traumatic the past month has been on all of us here, I can tell you we’ve spent a lot of time looking into the what, why, and how.  Obviously, fixing things won’t change the early negative reviews. But we’re big believers of word of mouth and we’ll see how things go as the game improves.

Version 1.1, however is almost purely new features and game play changes.  Briefly, here are the general changes:

  1. A global mana pool. Right now, every spell caster has their own private mana pool. This in turn allows players to imbue lots of units with spell casting ability who in turn can summon their own army of monsters.  In version 1.1, there will only be 1 mana pool to draw on and every summoned unit will have its own per turn mana cost to maintain it and every imbued champion will have a mana upkeep cost as well.  This goes back to our original concept of what a Channeler is: Are you going to keep your power for yourself and become incredibly powerful or spread it out into many creations?
  2. A revamp of the spells. Because of the above, we can have a much larger variance in the way spells function.
  3. Population becomes a stored resource rather than a consumed resource.  This means that soldiers, improvements, pioneers, etc. use population for them to function.  Players thus have to make choices between sending their citizens off to fight wars or use them to research new technologies, study spells, run your shops, etc.
  4. Money becomes more derived from people rather than things. Rather than relying on gold mines (which will still exist but won’t be the defacto source of wealth) money will come from the economic activity of your citizens (again, getting back to the concept of you’re rebuilding a society and your strength comes from the strength of your society).  The higher your population in a city, the more money it makes. Higher level cities gain access to improvements that magnify how much each citizen generates. Send your people off to war enmasse and you’ll hurt your economy.
  5. Training times for groups of units will have far less penalty. In essence, we will encourage larger sized armies to move towards more epic battles as well as reward those who have more developed, large cities (i.e. able to supply more citizens for training).
  6. Outposts won’t provide any housing anymore which also means no area of influence until you start housing people.  Outposts will function like…well, outposts. Guarding an area.
  7. Pioneers will be able build on resources outside your zone of control (as long as it’s neutral).
  8. Caravans will provide greater economic benefits but will no longer provide food.
  9. The new multithreaded AI will be in v1.1 which should allow the AI to fight a much more effective game and allow me to implement more background analysis functions (like in GalCiv II) rather than purely reactive (Elemental 1.0x).
  10. Technologies will begin provide special abilities to various types of units. In addition, special abilities will not be tied to “mana” but rather have a cooldown time (and in fact, cooldowns will be in generally).

This is, by no means, even a remotely complete list and it still pales compared to what we’ll be adding in the first free expansion.

We’re also in the process of further increasing staffing on Elemental based on analysis of what areas we need to improve internally. 

Anyway, v1.09E should be up this week, v1.1 should hopefully be ready sometime in October but no promises. We’re giving a lot of the team some time off to recover from the past few months.  At the very least, if you guys want a sneak peek, we can look at letting those who want to have access to our beta builds of v1.1 to tide them over (though I don’t recommend this for most users).

262,881 views 145 replies +2 Loading…
Reply #76 Top

Quoting Frogboy, reply 68

Quoting Pantasd, reply 60i think the bonus of getting the free expansion is done but iam not 100% sure

 

the first expansion is free to everyone no matter when you bought the game

 

the second expansion is free for ppl who own the game before 30 septembar
Correct. And the scope of both expansions has recently been increased so the first one won't be coming out in 2010 anymore.  It'll be clear why next week.
End of Frogboy's quote

 

that's great news more time = more new stuff :D makes me really happy

Reply #77 Top

I would also love to be involved in the beta for 1.1, That would be marvelous.

I remeber being so excited Pre-Ordering the collectors edition, and I havent been dissapointed. Your post-release service has been marvelous :) Can't wait for the expansion and for 1.1. Count me in!

Reply #79 Top

After reading about 1.1 upcoming changes I got disapointed.

It's all sounds like GalCiv2 with different units.

not that GalCiv2 was bad, but it's not really what we wanted , the 1.x despite many problem it had , had own "spirit" and I liked it. Now it's GalCiv2 again with different sprites.

 

Reply #80 Top

I would try the the beta if you will provide it to us. Thanks for your hard work. I really appreciate it.

Reply #81 Top

Numbers 3, 4, and 5 all seem part of a greater whole to me.  I was really frustrated with population because I found it very difficult to effectively use my population past a certain point.  Training up a bunch of powerful troops was difficult because of how costly they were in materials and gold.  So I ended up with just huge amounts of population sitting there and my cities didn't seem any more effective with large populations.  Isn't going to this new system where you have to choose between guns and butter similar to Master of Magic as well or am I remember that incorrectly?

I'm sure its probably too early to really get into this, but will there be differences in how the Kingdoms and Empires utilize population?  For instance, maybe when the Kingdoms put population points into spell research they can get that population back if needed, whereas, the Empires would use their thralls in a more expendable manner, like using them as living training exercises for their advanced troops. 

Also, is there any consideration in returning to one of the concepts in the Beta where cities could build multiple iterations of a building (workshop for instance) per city level?  I liked this idea because I liked the idea that my cities would specialize in certain functions especially if they happend to be in a spot that had a couple of mines or something.  I would have my forge city and then my research city and whatnot. 

Mostly, I would love to see population become a more dynamic resource used in a variety of ways.  Like, you could research various techs that would allow a portion of your population to be turned into a civil defense force when attacked.

Reply #82 Top

The 1.1 changes are looking good! :)

Reply #83 Top

Quoting Jandurin, reply 78
Um, this all sounds great.

Wouldn't mind trying the beta 1.1.

*shrug*
End of Jandurin's quote

I'd want in the beta 1.1 also.

 

 

Reply #84 Top

Glad to hear about the changes to outposts.  Maybe in the expansion we could also have building upgrades.  Like expanding on outposts so that units stationed there may have an opportunity to heal over time, friendly Caravans that tag an Outpost establish a road (which would be handy if you plan on having cities that are really spread out).

Reply #85 Top


After v1.09E, we’ll take a step back to see how people are playing multiplayer and start putting together plans for future improvements in that area based on the number of people in the community playing it.
End of quote

I think that Stardock need to be a bit careful on this bit, personally I haven't been giving Elemental as much attention as I want to just yet.  This comes down to two factors:

1) I happen to have been busy lately.

2) I have been at least partly holding off until the 1.1 update.

So I have yet to even try multiplayer, because if I'm going to put some time in then I'd rather wait a bit for the 'improved experience'.  I know that my brother decided to put the whole game to one side weeks ago and wait for 1.1.

My point, you have fans that have been following the game for a long time who are holding off while while you address the post-release fixes and balancing. We had originally planned on an MP match together on release day, but that sadly wasn't to be.  Do not be too quick to judge the MP interest before 1.1 comes out.

Reply #86 Top

Quoting Frogboy, reply 12

Any chance of some information on the first Expansion pack?  I think I remember reading that Tactical Battles are getting an over-haul?
I'd love to share those details but my PR minder would have me killed.  Poor Steph, she's been a real hero these past few months. Imagine your job being keeping me out of trouble?
End of Frogboy's quote

 

Frogboy can't share what's coming in the expansion pack so I will take a crack at it...

There are certain things this game desperately needs many of which you can see just from reading the forums... Interestingly, SD has publicly committed to many of them, but has been mum on the others...hmmmmmmm.

Therefore, the expansion pack must contain:

1.  Improved hero/champion system.  There will be more heroes and they will have more interesting and upgradeable skills and attributes.  This will apply to the sovereigns as well.

2.  Lots more quests.  There will be more random quests and better quest tracking capabilities.

3.  More notable locations.  There will be lots more notable locations including dungeon crawls.

4.  Uncommon/Rare/Unique item drops.  You get the idea. 

5.  Interactive landscape.  We'll see active volcanoes, forests that can be cut down and harvested, rain/snow, etc.

6.  More customizable troop options.  Yes, you'll finally get to create a gaggle of blond archers in pink dresses!

7.  Events.  You'll be able turn on/off or mod random events.

8.  Many UI improvements.  City screens, diplomacy overviews, interactive kingdom management dashboards, etc.

9.  Multi-player options.  Hotseat and PBEM.

10.  And finally ... BEAR FREAKIN CALVARY!!!

Any bets?

Reply #87 Top

I've refrained from playing the game since, oh, the release-ish version. Figured there was no reason to play it when the epic 1.1 will be coming soon.

I'm hoping that the twitching will stop in the immediate future...

-N

Reply #88 Top

Frogboy, thanks for the update.  The changes sound great.

Make sure you thank the rest of your team.

Reply #89 Top

I'm really confused about the whole process behind Multiplayer.

Frogboy himself said that he didn't feel that elemental had much potential as a competitive game. (Versus) But rather more enjoyable with a few friends against the AI. Now, that being said, the dev path still is pointing/leading towards competitive play. What's going on?

And the other thing that makes me even more confused, is that you say that you are waiting for player feedback in order to make changes to it. But you haven't enabled Coop play? So this means that all the feedback you are receiving is from people playing Versus. (Or against the AI... alone).

I really don't' understand the logic or purpose behind this. How are you going to make coop play better with versus feedback?

I'm really eager to play Multiplayer, with a friend, against the AI. Although I'd like to contribute to the MP experience, I am not at all interested in versus play.

I really think this whole different game for multiplayer concept should be thrown out the door, and simply focus on Singleplayer version, and make a direct port to MP, and THEN, work on it to make it better.

You, the dev team, basically created a multiheaded dragon to deal with, rather than one. Since all the techs were changed, support will have to be divided in two. (To some extent).

Although I won't be able to get a straight answer, I'd really like to know why was multiplayer version geared towards competitive play, even though it was stated that it would be best enjoyed in Coop play. And why was another version of the game created, rather than simply port the Singleplayer experience to Multiplayer?

I'm more than thrilled with the changes coming to Elemental, but still highly worried about the future of Multiplayer mode. I said it many times before, but I really wished that they would of just ported SP game to MP. And after everything is all balanced, if they wanted to venture towards a specific MP mode or chagnes. THEN... do it. Trying to do 2 things at once is usually a bad idea.

I really hope COOP mp mode can be implemented, so that the coop community CAN give feedback. I just find it ridiculous that the mode MP would be fun for, isn't implemetned, and that the feedback for the versus will be used as reference... My mind it is confused.

Still, thanks for the hard work, just hope coop MP will see the light of day.

Regards,

V

Reply #90 Top

And why was another version of the game created, rather than simply port the Singleplayer experience to Multiplayer?
End of quote

I wonder this myself since the single player(sandbox) portion of this game is really just multiplayer against the AI anyway. 

Reply #91 Top

Sounds good. I will give 1.1 another more serious play. I especially like the sound of the econ improvements.

Reply #92 Top

Looks to me that it is a fine update that you planned ! I only wished dynasties would get some love... Crossing my finger so that it happens for the first free expansion.

Count on me for the word of mouth ! :-) If it gets better than it is now, be sure I will let it be known to all of my friends.

Keep up the good work !

Reply #93 Top

Quoting Satrhan, reply 72

Quoting Frogboy, reply 68
Correct. And the scope of both expansions has recently been increased so the first one won't be coming out in 2010 anymore.  It'll be clear why next week.


That makes me both sad and happy at the same time

The changes for v1.1 sound great. Are you still going with the specialist slots btw?
End of Satrhan's quote

The reason for the delay will be really obvious after next week's announcement and I think will make people very happy.

Regarding v1.1, we're just referring to them as population requirements. Example, a Merchant will use up 5 of your population (the people don't go away, they're just working at the shop).

In addition, a command post will be needed to train more than 1 soldier at a time and will require a level 3 settlement (i.e. no outposts cranking out mass units).

Reply #94 Top

Regarding v1.1, we're just referring to them as population requirements. Example, a Merchant will use up 5 of your population (the people don't go away, they're just working at the shop).
End of quote

Population assignment would be less ambiguous and imply that those 5 population can not "meet the requirement" for multiple shops but are instead assigned to a particular shop.

Reply #95 Top

The reason for the delay will be really obvious after next week's announcement and I think will make people very happy.
End of quote

 

Now I´m nosy and i like to ask, but i would not make Steph´s job harder as it obvious is. ;)

Reply #96 Top

@Frogboy-Any news on balancing champions in melee combat? It'd be neat if they had a chance to withdraw in combat after taking severe damage. As of now a high level melee hero won't stand up to a squad of people. Too scared too be one hit after all that investment. Keep up the good work :) Very excited for expansions.

Reply #97 Top

Quoting Frogboy, reply 93

Quoting Satrhan, reply 72
Quoting Frogboy, reply 68
Correct. And the scope of both expansions has recently been increased so the first one won't be coming out in 2010 anymore.  It'll be clear why next week.


That makes me both sad and happy at the same time

The changes for v1.1 sound great. Are you still going with the specialist slots btw?
The reason for the delay will be really obvious after next week's announcement and I think will make people very happy.

Regarding v1.1, we're just referring to them as population requirements. Example, a Merchant will use up 5 of your population (the people don't go away, they're just working at the shop).

In addition, a command post will be needed to train more than 1 soldier at a time and will require a level 3 settlement (i.e. no outposts cranking out mass units).
End of Frogboy's quote

 

Question: What if your population drops?  Does the merchant stop functioning?  Could/should someone unable to take a town just raze the houses instead?

 

Reply #98 Top

How did I not see this thread until now? Hooray for information, and heck yes I'd be up for beta testing.

Reply #99 Top

Quoting Frogboy, reply 93

The reason for the delay will be really obvious after next week's announcement and I think will make people very happy.
End of Frogboy's quote

I'm sure it will, I just want it NOW:P (yes, I've been told I can be a bit impatient..)

Regarding v1.1, we're just referring to them as population requirements. Example, a Merchant will use up 5 of your population (the people don't go away, they're just working at the shop).
End of quote

What I was hoping for from the start, so I have to say: Excellent:thumbsup:

Reply #100 Top

To be honest I'm starting to wonder more and more about how food is going to be generated now that caravans won't produce them. Are we going to have buildable farms in cities again?