Sparhawk4242

Join Date 02/2006

How about using a Tracker instead of Forum?

Hi,

I think Stardock should set up a better way to report bugs, suggestions etc.

For example something like the openSource-Tool Trac.

With Trac we would also get a Wikipedia, which would also help a lot.

A Forum is definitely not the right way to go for bug-reporting:

- no search for entries => double entries

- no enforcement of reporting the important stuff => lot's of important information missing

So please put up something more convenient for you and us to report bugs.

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READ BEFORE POSTING - Beta Reporting Guide

https://forums.elementalgame.com/364285

"Due to the high importance of solving crash issues and the need to provide a non-text file, we ask that instead of using third party upload sites or the forums, please submit crash reports with the memory dump zip, your debug.err, and your dxdiag report attached directly to our bug tracking system. Submission of other bugs through that system is optional, but for crashes we do ask that you use it specifically. Although there is a suggestions category there, please keep those to the forums so that it doesn't get too full. There should also be a link to the bug tracker in your start menu should you need to use it."

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They have a fogbugz system setup. It's linked in the Beta reporting guide thread, (http://fogbugz.stardock.com/default.asp?pg=pgPublicEdit) but appears to be setup only for us to report bugs, not view open ones.

Kryo mentioned yesterday in the Bug Beta Compilation thread that he'll be starting the offical bug list thread tomorrow. (https://forums.elementalgame.com/364419)

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I do think they should have a separate forum for suggestions though. People are really jumping the gun with he sort of suggestions they're offering, compared to the stage of beta we're in right now, and its making a lot of noise drowning out the much more important technical feedback at this point.

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Sparhawk4242

Join Date 02/2006

Ok the tracker fogbugz helps a little bit...but then they should move all the bugs from the forum to that system.

But without an option to browse and see the bug database, users will still spam them...

So everybody is reporting the same again and again to them. Just like here in the forum.

...so that it doesn't get too full.

That is just the point. Especially as we are in for the long Beta Stardock should take the time now, to think about how they really want to handle all the bugreports.

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

I do think they should have a separate forum for suggestions though.

There is and has been an Elemental Ideas forum. People need to use it.

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

But without an option to browse and see the bug database, users will still spam them...

So everybody is reporting the same again and again to them. Just like here in the forum.

...so that it doesn't get too full.

Large numbers of reports on the things we're focusing on isn't a big deal--those can easily be grouped en-masse and collapsed together in the tracker. It's the non-bug stuff that is a concern, because it either doesn't belong there at all or can be troublesome to categorize.

- no enforcement of reporting the important stuff => lot's of important information missing

It's been asked for before, and now that we've exposed the tracker to the public my experience so far has been that those people who said letting users into the tracker would improve the quality and focus of feedback were flatly wrong. Untrained testers will still make poor reports even in a tracker.

We will not be exposing the full listing of cases in the tracker due to internal or potentially sensitive reports also being in there.

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kryo, how is the tracker? People are using it [properly] at all? What is your experience after the last 2-3 days?

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

Some are. As noted above lots of people are still submitting vague reports in the vein of "my game won't start", not including the needed attachments, or just putting stuff in there that doesn't belong.

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Quoting kryo,

reply 8

That's unfortunate. If there's a way perhaps it'd be a good idea to specify exactly what you're looking for on the bug tracker page. Also when you guys get your official bugs list going make it obvious there how to report new bugs and what you need for it to be helpful.

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. If there's a way perhaps it'd be a good idea to specify exactly what you're looking for on the bug tracker page.

Well, the bug tracker isn't only used for elemental since it contains bug reports I have made for GC2.

So I doubt you can easily set what you are expecting for beta1 elemental report since it is also used for others projects.

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

make it obvious there how to report new bugs and what you need for it to be helpful.

There's a sticky at the top of this forum (three of them, actually) about bug reporting.

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There's a sticky at the top of this forum (three of them, actually) about bug reporting.

But the sticky status is only visible if you visit the beta forum specifically https://forums.elementalgame.com/forum/623 If you look at the recent page https://forums.elementalgame.com/recent they don't appear as stickied and can be on page 2, 3, 4 ....

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

If stickies showed as stickied on the recent page it'd be entirely full of them since it shows all the categories. And most people seem to use the direct views anyway, rather than the all-recent page.

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Quoting kryo,

reply 5

I do think they should have a separate forum for suggestions though.

There is and has been an Elemental Ideas forum. People need to use it.

Well, that's fine , but if you really want people to direct their non compatibility/technical/testing oriented suggestions there, you should probably direct people to do that in the beta guide. Right now [suggestions] in a general sense are listed as an acceptable form of feedback.

That way, maybe as many as 30 % of people (roughly the percentage who ever bother to rread forum stickies) might actually take their advanced gameplay suggestions that are outside the scope of this beta phase there.

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