Morikar Morikar

[Suggestion] Simple growth model to get rid of pioneer banking

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[Suggestion] Simple growth model to get rid of pioneer banking

from Elemental Forums

Cities gain a growth bonus of up to +3 based on the ratio between current population and maximum population. Pioneers reduce population by 30 when put in the construction queue which allows the player the keep growth at +3 regardless of grain yield/food output by micro-managing pioneers into the queue whenever the growth bonus drops below +3 and pull them all out when there's enough population for a new settlement level.

The advantage of using the pioneer bank is significant especially for Empire factions (due to the lack of alternative sources for city growth bonuses) and in the early game and it seriously devalues grain yield compared to materials and essence when picking spots for new settlements. A city with a grain yield of 2 will grow just as fast as one with 6 and you can even use the bank to store any population in excess of the city's population limit until sufficient food buildings can be constructed.

I'd like to suggest that city growth be tied directly to grain yield instead by providing a +0.5 growth per grain yield. In addition to being simple, this model has a number of advantages over the current one:

- No growth advantage of using the pioneer bank (less micro-managing)

- More interesting choice when picking city spots. Do I want a fast growing city over one with higher production or more enchantment slots? Especially interesting considering that growth cant be rushed (at least until consulates become available for outposts).

- Gentle rain vs Nature's bounty becomes a choice between having a larger city vs. a faster growing one and may actually lead to some enchantment changes as the city matures.

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Reply #26 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting Brainjuggler, reply 25



Quoting RedAsphalt,
reply 21


Quoting Azunai_, reply 4or reduce growth to 0 if a pioneer is in the queue?

Simple, minimal side effects, and solves the problem entirely. This is good.

 


Works for me. I still want an engineer unit that builds outposts. Spending 30 pop AND losing a few turns of growth just for an outpost means I play Pariden all the time.
End of Brainjuggler's quote

Agreed. I just don't build outposts in games. I'd sooner make the land fertile for 200 mana and then build a new city than make an outpost.

There really should be a unit that specializes in outpost construction.

I really think that unit should be the scout since it's designed to SCOUT for resources in the first place. Having it set up shop when it's found what it's looking for is just a natural progression of what the unit is expected to do anyways.

Reply #27 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting GFireflyE, reply 26


Agreed. I just don't build outposts in games. I'd sooner make the land fertile for 200 mana and then build a new city than make an outpost.
End of GFireflyE's quote

Its different strokes i guess. 30 pop i don't consider that valuable of a resource, but 200 mana is terribly precious to me, i burn through it like its going out of style!

Elemental: Reforged
Reply #29 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting GFireflyE, reply 26


I just don't build outposts in games.

End of GFireflyE's quote

Interesting. I admit to using pioneer banking to affod it, but I normally have 2-5 outposts already by turn 50. I use them primarily to catch crystal and clay pits, but also to connect cities to fight unrest. Even if I had the fertilization tech by that time, I normally need all my mana for enchantments and fights, and would not consider spending 200 mana to fertilize. The chances to get a decent city location are just not good enough.

Reply #30 from Elemental Forums Top


I swim in mana in my games. I can't believe Meditation costs 0.

Once I get 3-4 cities going, two of them are usually conclaves and I push for that +4 mana improvement (forget it's name atm). Combined with the enchantment, I'm pulling in 15-20 mana a turn.

200 mana is small pittence.

 

If I have access to Arcane Monoliths, then I'll go straight into 4 outposts without the need for the cities since I don't have to take the population hit.