Summoning?

Hi, I'm just getting to grips with this game. I think I've got most of it down, but I'm still confused about summoning monsters.

 

Am I right in thinking that each summon spell can only be cast once at a time? I'd imagined that it might be possible to specialise in summoning to the extent that you could summon significant forces if you invested enough mana. But if you can only cast each one once then practically you're only likely to ever have a couple of summons - even as Procipinee! Have I missed something? Thanks!

14,094 views 10 replies
Reply #1 Top

You are essentially correct, however keep in mind the Imp summon is a special type that can cast any spell its master could cast. So if you cast it, you can then cast another of each summon. The Imp cannot summon another Imp.

Reply #2 Top

as far as i know, multiple champions with summoner traits stack (at least, last time i checked that was the case) - if your sov has the summoner profession  (+2 levels) and has summoner I/II/III from path of the mage, and you train another champ to also be a mage with summoner  I/II/III, your shadow wargs and elementals all start something like 8 levels higher then the default. i don't think summoning is viable as a grand strategy, but it's not as weak as one might think. 

i guess it can be fairly powerful if you focus on it early on. in later stages, trained troops tend to dominate the battlefield, and a few levels more for your summons can't really compare against large groups of heavily armored soldiers with high powered weapons. summoning is more of an early game advantage imo, and if you use it right, it can probably help you secure a strong position throughout the game.

Reply #3 Top

Thanks for the replies, that's very helpful. The imp/familiar summoning chain trick is very cool - that's a fairly good workaround actually, if you don't mind spending say 10hp and 300 mana to get a reasonable factory going. Feels a bit clumsy though, and I can't help but wonder if it's a bug rather than an intended feature.

Stacking summoner traits sounds like a bug to me - I don't understand why it would make sense from a thematic point of view.

It's a shame that you can't straightforwardly use summon spells to create armies of monsters. To me it seems like a cool alternative strategy. Do you know if it would be possible to make a modded summon spell which could be cast repeatedly?

 

Reply #4 Top

I'd like to see summon beefed up a bit.

I'm thinking as you increase in levels, not only do the summoned creatures get stronger, but also multiple can be summoned at once. And I's also like a greater variety of summoned creatures, up to and including one of the weaker dragons.

Yea, I know "That would be OP".

Well, I can dream, can't I?

Reply #5 Top

Summoning will be beefed up in Legendary Heroes, they talked about it when discussing the new champion leveling system. If you click the first screenshot on the LH page you can see the mage progression tree with the ability to summon skeletons in combat and such.

Reply #6 Top

Quoting phazonfreak, reply 5
Summoning will be beefed up in Legendary Heroes, they talked about it when discussing the new champion leveling system. If you click the first screenshot on the LH page you can see the mage progression tree with the ability to summon skeletons in combat and such.
End of phazonfreak's quote

I talk about dragons, and you mention skeletons?!?

Not even in the same ballpark... :grin:

Reply #7 Top

 

Quoting Borg999, reply 6

Quoting phazonfreak, reply 5Summoning will be beefed up in Legendary Heroes, they talked about it when discussing the new champion leveling system. If you click the first screenshot on the LH page you can see the mage progression tree with the ability to summon skeletons in combat and such.


I talk about dragons, and you mention skeletons?!?

Not even in the same ballpark...
End of Borg999's quote

 

Err...Skeletal Dragons?  Bone Dragons?:thumbsup:   

Reply #8 Top


Hi, I'm just getting to grips with this game. I think I've got most of it down, but I'm still confused about summoning monsters.

 

Am I right in thinking that each summon spell can only be cast once at a time? I'd imagined that it might be possible to specialise in summoning to the extent that you could summon significant forces if you invested enough mana. But if you can only cast each one once then practically you're only likely to ever have a couple of summons - even as Procipinee! Have I missed something? Thanks!

End of quote

Yes each champion can only cast each summoning spell he has once.  So he can only summon 1 Ice Elemental and 1 Earth Elemental if he has those spells.  He can cast those spells before the battle or during the battle if he has not already used the spell.

The AI tends to use its summons strategically and cast the spell before the battle and drags them around all the time, but that is not how I use them except in the early game when mana is short.  Casting before a battle is good in that it saves spell casting time and another  spell can be cast / action taken.  Also elementals and the shadow warg can gain exp and will level up like any other troop.  But they are slow, most only move 2 tiles per turn, so they slow your troops strategically once you use horses and wargs for your other units.  Tactically they are slow and start with your other troops so they take a long time to get involved in many battles if they are in the starting army and of course they take up an army slot replacing another trained unit or champion.

So once I have plenty of mana (in the middle / late game) I use summoning spells tactically and cast then in battles rather than before.  This means I can have more troops in a battle than my  number of slots, which is a huge advantage when attacking a well defended city or fighting a powerful monster like a dragon or wildland Boss.  The summoned elemental can be placed on any tile on the battlefield and I tend to put them right in the action, next to enemy archers or next to the dragon to act as a distraction.  The AI units will tend to deal with the summoned unit first and so this saves a lot of damage on my trained units which can use the time to get in position or deal damage.  The Ice Elemental is particularly useful againt big monsters if it gets a hit as that slows it by 3 initiative and that effect stacks with the slow spell.

That said, however, I do not use Summoning as a major theme and only use it as a useful support spell in tough battles. Other spells are often more useful or cost effective.  So I don't often pick the summoning promotion for champions. Most of the elementals get a boost from adding shards and towers (each water shard adds 1 level to your Ice Elementals etc.) and I rely on that to increase the power of the spell as time passes.

JJ

Reply #9 Top

Do the summoned creatures scale with the caster's rank?  I believe it does not, but may be wrong.

 

That would be a cool feature to include if it's not already in.

Reply #10 Top


No. The caster's rank does not affect the level of the summoned unit directly.  The summoner pick for a Sovereign gives +2 levels for all summons and each of the 3 levels for the summon promotion adds another +1 level.  Additionally permanent summons cast outside of battle can gain experience and further levels like other units

The basic level of elementals is also affected by the number of shards of the appropriate type for Ice, Earth and Fire types.  I'm not sure about the Air Elemental as that can only be cast from a scroll and I don't remember how that works.  

JJ