Outpost/City Hybrid possible?

1) No

2) No

3) No

Sounds to me like you want to just be able to build a city whereever you want.

EDIT: What you ask is all hardcoded (other than giving the ability to build a city, or build an outpost)

You can, however mod the game to be able to place a city where ever you wanted to.

Wasn't necessarily thinking of implementing all three ideas at once per-se. Mostly number 1.

Thank you for the answers before I wasted too much time on it. I'll play around with the city level types. I don't really want to place cities anywhere, I want Outposts to feel like (with investment) Castles.

But maybe I can make a different city type that can be placed anywhere that doesn't produce resources and has upkeep cost.

Thanks again guys.

Check this out, might do some of the things you want; https://forums.elementalgame.com/420301

I would prefer outposts cost my materials to build and actually had a build time.  But it sounds like you want to create a keep.  Which you already can do that.  In fact some of my more important outposts, that are in key locations.  I create a small force and place it on the outpost.  Then I have them guard.  I usually like either two mage units or bow units, with the ability to act first.  A mounted unit with the charge ability.  And then a big meat shield (or juggernaut in the case of the Verga)

It a small force but it can slow them down and at least take a a couple units while I move a better force into place.

The outposts are usually at choke points or are the ones that are plcaed pretty far away.  Also any of the outposts that are taken over instantly get an army to help take care of them.  Unless it is because I did something stupid.  Which happens, probably more than it should.  But I get distracted by what I am doing, and am not as thorough as I should be.

i want outposts with built in defenders, like in kohan II. i don't like this strange idea of leaving empty fortresses all over the map like a big ghost world, it's creepy. And the way they change hands instantly, if so much as a pioneer walks on top of them, it just seems wrong.

it would at least make holding territory easier, and not make outposts like whackamole.

Just wondering, can't you create a 3rd type of location between outpost and cities? Something along the lines of what was done by Frabulon.

I don't know, that is what I'll be attempting tonight based on the answers I've gotten thus far. NanakoAC gets why I'm interested in this.

I think it would be interesting to have Outposts be both easier to defend, but more expensive and less spamable. (Or at least have high upkeep costs).

A 3rd city type that gets placed anywhere, has upkeep and no resource production, and has its own defenders with some upgradable buildings will be tonight's project. I was unaware of Frabulon's work and will be downloading it and dissecting it ASAP.

I wasn't thinking of it as a spell, but that would be an okay way of implementing it, just have the spell cost Iron, Gold, and no mana.

Could also force pioneers to cast it, give it range of 0/1, and kill them.

I'm interested in a slightly different approach for this, but similar.

Build more units then . If you look at what the bonuses an outpost gives (the ones you see when you click upgrade), they all boost armies in its ZoC. The outpost is pretty much designed to give players a 5x5 field where they can roam armies and defend like a champ. Add in some roads to quick access, and cast raise terrain to make them slow enemies without upgrades if you wish. They're pretty powerful strategic tools.

Edit: Area Denial is the word I was looking for. Hell, you can add caltrops.

Ok a little update on the matter.I tried Frabulon's mod and what ever he did back then doesn't seem to work anymore

Either something is a true city hub, outpost or improvment build by the city ( i haven't look too much into the latter since i was unable to place them with spells sofar). However it is possible to have different kinds of outposts, and all of them buildable by pioneers. The code for this is hidden in the Pioneer unit.

...

        <GameModifier>
            <ModType>Unit</ModType>
            <Attribute>UnlockAction</Attribute>
            <StrVal>BuildTown</StrVal>  <--- this will always build a village city hub, or atleast i haven't found out how to change the building there
        </GameModifier>

        <GameModifier>
            <ModType>Unit</ModType>
            <Attribute>UnlockAction</Attribute>
            <StrVal>BuildImprovement</StrVal>
            <StrVal2>Outpost</StrVal2>  <--- this references the Improvment built
        </GameModifier>

So with the ability to try different outpost setups i tried different <GameModifier> on them. The following one is what is used to spawn monster from camps ( Darklings, Wildlings , Knight of Asok, etc. )

      <GameModifier>
        <ModType>Player</ModType>
        <Attribute>LimitedUnitCap</Attribute>
        <StrVal>OutpostDefender</StrVal>
        <Value>3</Value>
        <Provides>Recruit 3 OutpostDefender</Provides>
      </GameModifier>

Since those Defenders are NOT supposed to run around I out fitted them with the Attribute

    <GameModifier>
      <ModType>Unit</ModType>
      <Attribute>Immobilize</Attribute>
    </GameModifier>

So now we have an immobile unit, which wont ask for directions at the end of turn, and a new one spawns every 10 turns ( default setting) to a maximum of 3.

Sadly the result looks as ugly as the implementation, as they stand around with a giant X over their heads and we are still restricted with the maximum army size on that tile so more then 4 defending units create 2 army stacks unless drill, cooperation or the like is researched.

If any one can find a way to make them invisible on the clothmap (reducing size to 0 still leaves the socket and the X), or has any other new idea please keep this thread alive

Try to search for Scale and Shrink attributes in the files, one of them might help (didn't look at these much so can't be more specific).

I tried scaling and es it does get rid of the model, however it keeps the socket that units stand on as well as the immobilize icon intact and at 100% size

I agree with this! The outposts should be more like fronteer villages. I've already completely replaced the default tiles in my game to "look" more "town-like". My kingdoms already have a far more natural feel to them this way, but I still think that they should be able to defend themselves against a single pack of wolves or a pioneer at least. 

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by socket, but regarding the immobilize icon:

Create a copy-paste of immobilize (internal name immobilize2 or something)

Remove everything that resemble graphics and effects.

If it causes bad stuff, try giving it a 1pixed blank image.

This might be a dumb question, but regarding defenders, tried adding this upgrade/mod to the outpost?

Every unit model in the cloth map stands on a little pedestal. Square for normal units round for champions and an eightsided star for the Sovereign. The idea with immobilze sounds good, however i have no idea how to do that? Where are the attributes referenced? The Unit attribute call was as low in the chain as i could get.

I coudn't even find the icon in the Gfx folder, could you give me some pointers as to where to look?

Saidly CityDefenseSummon seems to only work in cities, oddly enough the out post does not add those units to the city however, they seem to be lost.

Interesting.

Regarding immobalize:

Sadly, now that I look at it, I cannot seem to find it. The attribute is most likely HardCoded.

What you could do, though, is give them -5 movement (so people won't give them a bit and start walking around with them), and start the fight with +7 movement buff, thus making sure it doesn't use the immobilize icons.

Regarding cloth icons-

I'm not really sure how this works, as I failed to find the actual icon referenced by the XML, but using

<ClothIcon>...</ClothIcon>

might work. It's being used on things such as resources.

hm i have been toying around with it but to no luck it seems the game builds up the clothmap figure from the hbk's there are even hbk's for the sockets i mentioned in a gfx sub folder called Stands. I haven't tried to get rid of the immobilize sofar since this is already just a dirty work around which I guess will turn out as a rather dead end on the road to decently defended outposts

1) I agree it's should had a defender like city but should be better

2)Only those upgrade, but can't make best troop, only those city of fortness can do that

3)Yes, and they should train low end troop with limited but not like those city....

4)they shouldn't making money but cost a money per turn...

way I see, it's seem logic...