After all these years...

from Elemental Forums

I have always thought that in turn based games like this, the time scale is weird and a little insane. The popular measurement is 1 turn equals 1 season/3 months. Some games that time scale can work, but for others like this, it doesn't. I could understand maybe 1 turn=1 month though 1 week would probably be better. It is just crazy that it can take up to a year to travel between an outpost and the capital Am I the only one that has a problem with this? 

This lead me to an interesting idea, if I was to ever make a game like this, this is what I would do. Each tile would represent about 3 kilometers/2 miles. a turn would be 1 day and units would have travel speeds based on factors like gear and mounts, and every unit would have stamina. The idea being a unit would move a realistic distance in a realistic amount of time. stamina would be a representation of the suggested travel distance, if you keep your units at a normal pace and let them rest at night, then Stamina is restored. but if you rush them and push them through the night, they will exhaust. exhausted units suffer heavy penalties, especially in combat. since the game would have a day night cycle, it would be possible to lead soldiers in night raids. and decimate an enemy army while they are resting.

Anyway, this is just some sleep depraved ramblings about a peeve of mine, so whatever.

8,760 views 8 replies
Reply #1 from Elemental Forums Top

The problem is the strategic elements such as building and researching ... in the real world, wonders like the Great Pyramid of Giza took 20 years to build.  At 1 day = 1 turn, 365 x 20 = 7300 turns to complete one ancient-era wonder.  That's a lot of clicking "End Turn."

When you have to build, research and move, building and researching will take unplayably long if you try to put the realism on the movement side of things.

 

 

Reply #2 from Elemental Forums Top

As far as wonders go, yeh that makes sense, but in a magic heavy fantasy setting, great wonders could possibly be constructed faster due to magical aid and devices that makes the hard labor easier. Unfaltering golems, floatings disks that can be used to swiftly carry heavy objects. levitational magic to lift slabs of stone into the right place. it is plausible great structures could be erected in a matter of weeks. 

Offworld Trading Company
Reply #3 from Elemental Forums Top

Not really.  One could consider the Death Star in Star Wars (for 'serious' science fiction fans, its more fantasy than science fiction) to be a 'Great Wonder' (if evil), but it took more than a decade to build the first one.

Even in fantasy settings with magic, things don't happen overnight.  Armies of darkness may suddenly attack out of seemingly nowhere and do BadThings(tm) where none were thought to be, but often there's a story that they've secretly been build up for years prior to the surprise attacks.

Reply #4 from Elemental Forums Top

I to have issues with the time scale, but there are major flaws as Chibiabos points out. The day / night cycle I like and the wonder building is not something that can be done in a month.

The real problem seems to be that the size of the world vs. time scale. It take 1 year to travel to an outpost 8 tiles away. But if you consider the terrain is rugged (hiking does take some time over uneven terrain in the appropriate direction and stay fit for a fight takes some time. Each square in this game would be about 60 miles x 60 miles. or maybe even 100 miles x 100 miles. I take the building of buildings to be another representation of scale. It is not that you are building say 1 well, but a series of wells in the city. If we pictorially done it we might as well be playing sim city here and everything would be tiny. The cities built and founded are representations of the big city in the area. But, there are several small hamlets throughout your area of influence.

But I digress in the abstract representation that the game is presenting here. If there was some clean way to run a day night cycle that would be nice, maybe have a represetation of 3 times of day... Early Morning (foggy , sun up), Late Afternoon (bright and sunny), Night (dark and starry). Throw some whether in the mix and you've got yourself a cycle to do on top of the seasonal game turns here.

Reply #5 from Elemental Forums Top

I like the scale, but hope there is a season inclusion for the expansion. That would be very nice.

Reply #6 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting parrottmath, reply 5
I to have issues with the time scale, but there are major flaws as Chibiabos points out. The day / night cycle I like and the wonder building is not something that can be done in a month.

The real problem seems to be that the size of the world vs. time scale. It take 1 year to travel to an outpost 8 tiles away. But if you consider the terrain is rugged (hiking does take some time over uneven terrain in the appropriate direction and stay fit for a fight takes some time. Each square in this game would be about 60 miles x 60 miles. or maybe even 100 miles x 100 miles. I take the building of buildings to be another representation of scale. It is not that you are building say 1 well, but a series of wells in the city. If we pictorially done it we might as well be playing sim city here and everything would be tiny. The cities built and founded are representations of the big city in the area. But, there are several small hamlets throughout your area of influence.

But I digress in the abstract representation that the game is presenting here. If there was some clean way to run a day night cycle that would be nice, maybe have a represetation of 3 times of day... Early Morning (foggy , sun up), Late Afternoon (bright and sunny), Night (dark and starry). Throw some whether in the mix and you've got yourself a cycle to do on top of the seasonal game turns here.
End of parrottmath's quote


Perhaps as I said, a turn should represent a month or a week. if it takes 20 turns to build a wonder, then 20 weeks is about 5 months. and given again the idea of magical aided construction with a tireless workforce of Golems, (perhaps a golem workforce being a research benefit you can gain)  otherwise build time would be double length, then it certainly seems like a very plausible time scale that fits. 

Reply #7 from Elemental Forums Top

I'm wondering if the devs initially thought of seasons changing the map like they do in Lord of the Realsm II. That game looked cool because winter there was snow on everything, spring everything was fresh and new, etc. The engine problems might have put all that to the backburner. Just speculating. With that said, the fact they left it as seasons instead of months or weeks gives me hope that seasons may change in some future edition.

Reply #8 from Elemental Forums Top


@argol228: Since this game is soo moddable maybe you can do exactly what you want... here is a thread that might interest you

https://forums.elementalgame.com/434786