[9.5] Starting Location Issues

whut, probably would help with a screenshot or two, and the details in which you generate the random map (map size, and map type (balanced, mountain, etc).

I usually see essence in my starts though, might be your just damn unlucky

Sincerely
~ Kongdej

The start is mostly random, with preference for fertile lands. I had a starting location with no fertile land in sight once in 0.95.

I suspect that the map is still pre-made and not randomly generated, as I landed on similar spot at-least twice.

On the other hand, I agree that 3+ material and 1+ essence is pretty mandatory for a starting location, though I could say that for being cornered and stuck between a mountain and sea at the start as well.

I think chance to get essence at the start is high, but not 100 %. In 3 games (medium map, hard difficulty, standard settings) i had once 0 Essence, once 1 Essence and once 2 Essence, but the 0 Essence should not happen, because Essence is very important.

I have to agree about starting locations being incredibly feh on average.

I've started two games tonight (a testament to the improved AI), and both of them took at LEAST 5 restarts to meet my requirements (3/3 or better with 1 or more essence and at least one resource of any sort within immediate visibility). I don't think that I'm being unreasonable in the least for the place the sovereign decides to stop wandering the wilderness and says "this place is good enough for me to stop wandering and found my empire".

In terms of the mountains, I really hate how thick these worlds are with mountain ranges. They feel linear and constrained constrained. Almost like a Starcraft map with little direction, where you have a randomly generated "first expansion" spot, and then contention land everywhere else. No flexibility.

True, the initial resource distribution seems to be a bit better in 0.95, but there's still a long way to go.

Yesterday for example i had bad luck on a row and control-N'd my way through at least 5 starting spots without essence and very meager resources.

@Malsqueek:
Agreed, mountains for creating barriers and choke points would be fine, but often they're so massive, that i only see them as a waste of map space.
Especially when they cut off ranges of 2 tile wide coastlines and make them very unattractive for settling or outposting in the process.

I think a starting position should have a minimum of 6 total grain/materials plus at least 1 Essence.   

I'm undecided on whether essence should be a right  or a bonus on start location. But I will Ctrl-N if there is no location within range that doesn't have at least 3+ material for production. Production is far too vital in this build to have a slow starting city.  It's simply not an option to start a game with a 2 material bonus to get your infrastructure moving, even with essence and enchanted hammers.

(I also always play with scrying pools, so perhaps I'm more lenient on the lack of essence).

Try not to bingjack, just for a change of pace

Sides I did start a map with a 4 grain, 2 material and 3 essence spot, that made for nice building times too ^^
Personally I still think Essence is way too important.

Sincerely
~ Kongdej

It *is* powerful. Which is why I sort of think it should be rarer, and not a gimme on a start location. It makes a city a "magic city".  1 Essence doesn't do a lot on its own, but a city with a 2+ essence should be something you're willing to go to war for.

On the other hand if essence is too rare, it greatly diminishes an entire field of spells.

I think maybe City spells should have a flat bonus, and not scale with # essence, while # of essence still determines how many "perks" you can run.

Like I said, I'm still forming an opinion. I'm not sure it needs to be a gimme. To me it's sort of like saying "I need to start with a magic weapon". It's great to have, and certainly powerful, but not necessary to start with. A normal city will get me up and running, as long as it has a high enough material value. I'm not gimped with a 3/4/- city in any way.  The AI certainly doesn't seem to value essence that much...most of their cities are essence-less.

Essence isn't optional it's downright mandatory.  To top it off, a city with no essence means no city enchants.  It's that important.  You can't even cast. 

This is the first build I even remembered to use city buffs, except on my one military production city, which was almost never my starting city.  Theyre powerful and useful, but I fail to see how they're mandatory. A good solid production city within spitting distance of some shards was good enough before. It's good enough now to get started. 

Like I said, you're competing against the AI, which only seldom utilizes an essence source. So that's a big advantage over your opponents. So it's great if you roll one to start with. And if I see one out in the world, I'm going to grab it. But mandatory? Hardly. Obviously a 2 essence city would provide you with the potential for a number of bonuses, but I have yet to hear a compelling argument why anyone would be gimped with a 3/4/0, or a 4/4/0 starting city.

I'm not arguing against it. I havent fully formed my opinion yet. I'm just not certain I see the case for essence as a gimme. It seems like a luxury to me. I think people are just sort of used to the idea that theyre supposed to be able to cast as many buffs on any city they want, and clearly that has changed. Now they are more like slotted magic items you find, with the city spells being the "gems" you can insert to it to customize it with magical bonuses to suit your wishes.

If you are correct and the AI is not using enchantments on their cities then that is an AI problem.  I love that they switched to add Essence as part of the game which enables you to cast city spells.  It provides even more strategy.  

I just want a minimum of 1 Essence on starting cities - and what I mean is that all  starting cities mine and the AI.  I expect them to cast those spells on their cities as they feel best suits their style/strategy.

I often get starting positions with no settlement tiles so having an essence tile is a bonus.

More importantly is having an area for your second and third city within a reasonable distance and not being land locked in by an AI territory when looking for your second city leaving war as the only option in the early game.

Well the reason it's seldom is cause founding second cities is like the first,  never know what you're going to get.  The AI does make use of Essence.  Not all of my cities have essence.  It's much the same with AI.  It's much more important though when can be used either to build stuff faster or tech up faster (enchanted hammers / inspiration ).