Ocean ships and creatures » Forum Post by Bellack

Thormodr

Join Date 09/2009

+11

Quoting Lord Xia,

reply 24

Boats, are a pretty basic requirement of a TBS game on a terrestrial map. I hate the idea that if something can't be done magnificently, then just cut it completely away. That concept has lost WoM games boats, dynasties, and minor factions, and I don't feel for the better.

Well, E:FE is pretty well put up or shut up for Stardock. If they fail at this then there won't be any more Elemental. They need to focus.

So, that is my reasoning anyway. Really nail the land part of it and redeem the company in the eyes of consumers. Make a spectacular expansion after that and trot out naval stuff, dynasties and a ton of other cool things.

Don't get me wrong though. I'd love to see it in the Vanilla game too.

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I know you are probably right. I guess I am worried because I felt that when WoM had the failed launch, they decided to take away features of the game and then fix what was left. To be honest, I felt that what they took out was worth more than they fixed.

Can we do a simple change like dynasties and add boats back in?

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Solam

Join Date 03/2007

+16

I'm not programing geek but MOM hafd boats? right? So did Warcraft 2? Those games are similar to this game? right?

Why is it hard now and it was possible before? I don't get it,.

Maybe somebody can explain it to me?

It's like random maps. In WOM you could not get random maps but in MOM you could...

Very coofused.

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yeah i guess my feeling is, if there aren't going to be boats*, then don't have islands or separate continents.

*or some other mode of transit that the AI knows how to use

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Quoting Solam,

reply 28

I'm not programing geek but MOM hafd boats? right? So did Warcraft 2? Those games are similar to this game? right?
Very coofused.

Age of Wonders 1 also had transport boats. Did you see how AI used them? In fact it was hilarious -- for example, sometimes it loaded them with troops just to unload them in the same place. In Warcraft 2 sea transports were easier to manage since the maps were not random and were simpler, and -- I bet -- naval AI was scripted (at least on some maps). I didn't play MoM much, but as far as I know the AI suck big time. I would prefer to play a game with no ships rather than with crappy naval AI.

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DsRaider

Join Date 11/2008

+70

Well WarcraftII is a real time game, not sure if that makes it harder or easier though. I do remember the AI using transports fairly well... I believe they occasionally got stuck or dropped off units in weird places. Also combat ships tended to mass against your coast even if you had no navy of your own.

Some sort of teleporter tile could also work, either as an actual telporter shrine or some sort of natural harbor. That way you could have continents and far away islands. Honestly I would rather wait for boats though.

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mqpiffle

Join Date 10/2010

+44

I want giant flying boat-like cyber-steam-punk death-dinosaurs.

Let the devs get what they want out of the core game mechanics first, then maybe we will see something like boats, sea resources, and nautical monsters in a future version.

I do think it would be seriously amazing to embark my heroes on Ulysses-like adventures.

+1

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Wintersong

Join Date 07/2006

+235

Quoting mqpiffle,

reply 32

I want giant flying boat-like cyber-steam-punk death-dinosaurs.

Let the devs get what they want out of the core game mechanics first, then maybe we will see something like boats, sea resources, and nautical monsters in a future version.

I do think it would be seriously amazing to embark my heroes on Ulysses-like adventures.

I would love submarine maps with underwater races/cities. But I suppose that "two planes" a la MoM is not even considered for a FE expansion...

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I just want to be able to cross the water, without being forced to pick or make a sov with earth magic. If boats are too difficult, just make it so raise land, can be used by any sov without requiring specific spell books. I think that's easier than asking for all land masses, to always be connected. Whats the point of having a big world, if you can't reach half of it?

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Quoting stevty2889,

reply 34

Whats the point of having a big world, if you can't reach half of it?

Is that the case in FE beta (I don't have access to it)?

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Quoting Alstein,

reply 17

AOW:SM boats/navies were non-functional. The AI would never use them.

Civ4 took fan patches to make boats useable. This is not something trivial to add, but it is something I'd want as a focus for the 2nd expansion

Actully after the community patch in AOW:SM the AI could use the sea units very well. I had over 300 sea creatures and ships alone which made the oceans very deadly. But you are right before the patch the AI seldom used the ships

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Yeah ships are a huge lacking at the moment, especially with the rate at which city borders grow. I'm pretty quickly locked out of further exploration as other civs wont let me waltz hrough their territory unless I go to war, but they happily blunder through mine all the time.

Still lots for me to learn though. Does water magic have a water walking spell??

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Quoting stevty2889,

reply 34

I just want to be able to cross the water, without being forced to pick or make a sov with earth magic. If boats are too difficult, just make it so raise land, can be used by any sov without requiring specific spell books. I think that's easier than asking for all land masses, to always be connected. Whats the point of having a big world, if you can't reach half of it?

Howdy,

Not true, you can cross water with out earth magic. If a champion has earth magic you can cast from your spell book. You can play this game without picking any magic and stack champions with all the branches if you want. You need to make sure to level the champ with earth magic to get the raise and lower spell, along with the advance mountain building one.

Make sure to explore the game further and experiment to check out some cool tricks.

Thanks,

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Quoting Gandhialf,

reply 30

Quoting Solam, reply 28I'm not programing geek but MOM hafd boats? right? So did Warcraft 2? Those games are similar to this game? right?
Very coofused.

Age of Wonders 1 also had transport boats. Did you see how AI used them? In fact it was hilarious -- for example, sometimes it loaded them with troops just to unload them in the same place. In Warcraft 2 sea transports were easier to manage since the maps were not random and were simpler, and -- I bet -- naval AI was scripted (at least on some maps). I didn't play MoM much, but as far as I know the AI suck big time. I would prefer to play a game with no ships rather than with crappy naval AI.

amphiby invasions seems like a recurring problem to me in a lot of games.

i remember they existed in rome total war, then when medieval:TW 2 got out, IA was unable to use them and they took the whole 3 majors patches (and more than a year) to get it back.

the again, when empire:TW got out, again the IA couldn't use it, and it took two patches in which the fix was mentioned to get it working again at some degree.

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Quoting AM_Shark,

reply 38

Quoting stevty2889, reply 34
I just want to be able to cross the water, without being forced to pick or make a sov with earth magic. If boats are too difficult, just make it so raise land, can be used by any sov without requiring specific spell books. I think that's easier than asking for all land masses, to always be connected. Whats the point of having a big world, if you can't reach half of it?

Howdy,

Not true, you can cross water with out earth magic. If a champion has earth magic you can cast from your spell book. You can play this game without picking any magic and stack champions with all the branches if you want. You need to make sure to level the champ with earth magic to get the raise and lower spell, along with the advance mountain building one.

Make sure to explore the game further and experiment to check out some cool tricks.

Thanks,

I realize I might be able to get a champion with earth magic. None the less, I would rather not have crossing water restricted to a single school of magic, especially since it cost 50 mana for each raise land, so to make a 10 tile "bridge" is 500 mana..not exactly an ideal way of setting out across the sea..

And there is also no gurantee, that in every single game you play, you'll be able to get a champion that has earth magic, in my current game, I've uncovered the entire continent, and only was able to recruit a total of 2 champions, on a medium sized map.

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NorsemanViking

Join Date 03/2006

+19

I have the following vision (for an expansion pack obviously):

- You can build harbors and shipyards if cities are located near beaches, as in WOM

- You have transports and warships, and an own unit designer for ships as well. Techs that gives new equipment for ships etc must be implemented in the tech three. Alternatively new tech could make new pre-made ship models available. Different kinds for kingdoms and empires.

- Transports can transport an army, but are nearly defenceless. Warships can be used to kill transports, escort transports, blockade enemy ports etc.

- Tactical battles are not between armies on a ship HOMM-style, but warships fighting it out, and transports trying to survive. Moving an army over the seas is a risky business. Feel the excitement of taking the risk, scout for the enemy fleet, where can it be? Will our invasion be noticed, and perhaps intercepted?

- Champions and Sovereigns can learn navigation skills and certain artifacts should give bonuses to seabattles, sea movement, and to fighting seamonsters

- Navies can appoint one champion as an Admiral. His sea traits gives bonuses to the fighting fleet during sea battles. The rest of armies on board are sitting ducks if the sea battle should be lost.

- The sea will have it's own specific creatures, monsters and quests. (Some you must bring a land army to fight, some you engage with your war fleet (earning experience for your admiral))

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