DerekPaxton DerekPaxton

Fallen Enchantress- Main User Interface

Fallen Enchantress- Main User Interface

We had some specific, and significant, goals for the User Interface of Fallen Enchantress.  First we wanted a beautiful world to explore.  Second we wanted a UI that got out of the way and allowed you focus on that world.

It's always hard to decide what you want on the Main UI.  There are a lot of moving pieces in a 4x game, a lot of things we could show.  But every piece has a cost.  Do we put the minimap on the main UI, do we expect players to use it (ie: is it really helpful, or should we do work to make it more helpful)?  What stats are displayed when you have a unit or city selected?  How cool looking should decorations be?  How cool looking should locations be?  How much visual variety should exist in the world?

Checking out the screenshot above you can see the answer to most of those questions.  Yes, we want players to use the minimap, and yes we had to do some work to make it more helpful.  There is a lot of visual variety in the world, rivers and chasms, blooming green lands, ruined purples, barren browns.  Even within those variations you can see lots of color and depth.

 

                Its also important that the terrain plays a key role in the game, that it is more than just a pretty face.  Different land types host different sorts of resources, and different type of monsters.  In general fertile land has a lot of the city resources while forests and swamps host more monsters and might be dangerous to settle next to.  Rivers allow you to build special improvements that help you cities take off, especially for kingdom players (empire players have improvements that don't have the river requirement and are better at surviving in less hospital terrain).

                In the above screenshot you can see a bandit camp on the edge of the southern forest.  A band of river skath sitting just out of my borders (they will become a problem if I don't do anything about them).  An air shard up the river and a fire shard on the other side of the river.  Around the air shard there is an Inn, a great place to pickup quests and some horses.  And by the fire shard there is another monster lair and a champion I may be able to recruit.  It's a fairly good starting location with lots to explore.

                You may also notice that the city bar has been replaced and now shows what is being built in the city.  Cities have production based on their population, improvements and some player decisions we will go into later.  We got rid of the system where everything had a flat cost (a Command Post always took 12 turns to build no matter what size city it was built in) and now, in general, larger cities are better at producing units than smaller cities.

 

 

                Despite the greater variety in the starting environments, we still want to maintain the players ability to transform the world as your empire grows.  Empire lands aren't as dark as they were in War of Magic for practical reasons (it was hard to see units on them).

                The map has also gone through considerable rework.  Notice the amount of inland bodies of water.  With those, mountains and chasms forming natural choke points specific pieces of land become more valuable and allow players to focus their armies at key locations.  Owning a pass of an extensive mountain range means more, as does wiping out a Bone Ogre that is keeping you from getting through to valuable resources.

                Also notice the large Spellbook button on the bottom right of the screen.  Any strategic spell your casters have access to can be cast from here.  You don't have to find the caster.  If you want to raise a mountain and you have all the requirements, go into your spellbook and cast it.  If you want to enchant a city or unit, open a Shadow Gate or drop a Falling Star on an enemy army, it can all be done from here.  This was hotly debated.  There is a psychological effect as the player doesn't feel like his champion or sovereign is casting the spell.  Your fire archmage champion didn't seem to cast that spell (even though we show who is able to cast it in the spellbook, so you know who is enabling these spells) which removes a little of your feeling of connection and attachment to them.  But we gain the fact that magic feels very global and player based.  If you have mana and powerful casters you can start unleashing spells.  And of course it's fatser and easier than hunting for casters.

 

                There is some cheating going on in the above picture.  You can probably tell that I've given myself a bunch of free resources (including horses which isn't normally possible for Empire players).  And there are a lot more monsters and quests around my starting location than you would expect for someone marching around with a Guardian Statue.  I've also been using a cheat to remove the fog of war in all these screenshots so you could see the maps on the minimap.

                But there are good things to show here as well.  first you may notice that the Empire tree on the left hand side of the screen has changed.  It is now broken into 3 sections, Units, Cities and Quests.  Each section is collapsible so you can minimize the cities list if you aren't interested in it (or the whole thing if you don't use it).  The quests tree is new, and clicking on any of those entries takes you to the location you are supposed to go to next.  In general quest distances are shorter than they were in War of Magic, but we don't want players to have to spend any time manually looking around for quest locations, click the button and it will show you where you are supposed to go.

                You can also see the attribute icons for my Guardian Statue.  He is large, so he can't be knocked prone, and immune to both poison (as all un-living things are) and critical hits (as all golems are).  You can also see the mouse over for the cave bear which reports on his moves, attack, defense and hit points.  If the player wants more information then that you can click on the bear and see more detail.

                It has been 1 year since War of Magic released and about 9 months since I started at Stardock.  It has been an amazing job for me and I'm very lucky to be able to work with all the great folks at Stardock.  I hope the above screenshots give some indication of how hard we have been working, and the world Fallen Enchantress will allow you to explore and conquer.

 

163,047 views 75 replies
Reply #26 Top

Hello Derek.

FE is looking good. A small question regarding cities and environments: Frogoboy said in an earlier journal that the cities will be more civ-like, and you shown it by the example of production.

Which raises the question: how will the environment affect the city? While a river grants the option of certain buildings, will mountains, hills and forest affect the city the same way as grassland but with a movement penalty, or the player might consider making some more for extra production?

Reply #27 Top

Looks awesome Derek. You keep showing us that you know what makes games great. The Quest tree is something people have wanted for a long time.

The only thing that I will be critical of is kingdom only use of rivers. Race specific resources didn't work so well for horses and wargs. Can't wait for the beta!

Reply #28 Top

Quoting DsRaider, reply 27
Looks awesome Derek. You keep showing us that you know what makes games great. The Quest tree is something people have wanted for a long time.

The only thing that I will be critical of is kingdom only use of rivers. Race specific resources didn't work so well for horses and wargs. Can't wait for the beta!
End of DsRaider's quote

  Rivers aren't kingdom only.  The kingdom have an additional early game improvement that they can only build on rivers.  Empires have a similar (though not as good) improvement that doesnt require a river.  There are improvements available to both that require rivers.  In other words, rivers are always good, but a little better for kingdom players.

Reply #29 Top

I like what I'm seeing. Although, there would be one tiny little thing. The map could be a little rounder, to fit the design of the other panel. 

Reply #30 Top

Thanks for clearing that up Derek.

Hmmm, I just realized that none of the screen shots show the material resource. I wonder if it has been replaced by the new city production.

Reply #31 Top

What overlays are available? I don't see a button that gives you instant access to useful information like tile yields, defensive strength of tiles, mobility, mana production in various cities or tiles, heat map for monster spawn probability (something you REALLY ought to include, random monster spawns suck but a heat map showing where they are likely would let the player plan for it at least), etc etc. 

Ability to set AI nations to have a secondary color based on their relationship to me would be nice (red for war, yellow for ceasefire, grey for neutral, green for pacts other than alliance or marriage, blue for alliance or marriage).

 

We need info, yo! Hide it in an overlay but lemme turn that sucker on!

Reply #32 Top

Quoting Aeon221, reply 31
What overlays are available? I don't see a button that gives you instant access to useful information like tile yields, defensive strength of tiles, mobility, mana production in various cities or tiles, heat map for monster spawn probability (something you REALLY ought to include, random monster spawns suck but a heat map showing where they are likely would let the player plan for it at least), etc etc. 

Ability to set AI nations to have a secondary color based on their relationship to me would be nice (red for war, yellow for ceasefire, grey for neutral, green for pacts other than alliance or marriage, blue for alliance or marriage).

 

We need info, yo! Hide it in an overlay but lemme turn that sucker on!
End of Aeon221's quote

nice call!

Reply #33 Top

There is a psychological effect as the player doesn't feel like his champion or sovereign is casting the spell.  Your fire archmage champion didn't seem to cast that spell (even though we show who is able to cast it in the spellbook, so you know who is enabling these spells) which removes a little of your feeling of connection and attachment to them.

 

Some distance from your sov is a necessary thing in a 4X game - even one with RPG elements like Elemental.  Now if we could get Elemental to be sufficiently detached from specific sovs so as to allow for offspring to inherit the throne....  :pout:  

 

Also, I think the UI should just completely abandon the red dot/blue dot empire tree.  It just doesn't convey any useful information. 

Reply #34 Top

Quoting Tridus, reply 10

Quoting Alstein, reply 1Unrelated but you mentioned it.

 

I really wish Empire could get horses.    Wargs should be an exotic mount that requires a random tech.   I don't feel the current setup in WOM is a good design decision, it's just a nuisance.  At a very minimum, I'd make horses a food resource for Empires, and wargs a food resource for kindgoms.

Yeah, me too. I'd rather see horses as the generic mount and wargs as a rarer weird special mount. But the way it is right now I seem to always as Kingdom start next to wargs, which is just a wasted tile. Maybe it'd make more sense if it was more common, but that's the ONLY resource that works that way so it's just out of place.
End of Tridus's quote

 

I actually disagree (or in the least, don't agree with you, I might just be ambivalent), there is no reason in my mind why various ethnic groups shouldn't value some resources and underutilize others - this has been a recurring theme throughout our own (human) history wherby certain groups of people simply don't realize the value of resources that seem obvious to others (the polar expeditions by Europeans using horses (instead of sled dogs), or the Greenlandic/Vinlandic Norse refusing to eat seals, etc, etc). 

 

Designing resources in this way makes the game more interesting, and also requires more strategic decisions: do I build on top of a warg pit that I can't use simply to deny the enemy this resource?  If everyone could ride wargs the answer would be obvious, but if it's simply a tactic for resource denial, well, that's a more subtle question.

 

Personally, I wouldn't mind race-specific resources in the future - maybe the wraiths need access to willow-the-whisps that only reside in bogs, or Tarth requires protein shakes that only grow on protein-shake-trees, but no other races actually have any use for these (though perhaps they can develop tech to harvest them and then have the simply for trading (cornering the protein-shake-market might be lucrative if Tarth is in a position to dominate the map/game).

 

Just my thoughts...  if you want better mounts then perhaps there can be a unicorn or pegasis loft in the mountains that players can find (but empires cannot use), and likewise lycanthropic wargs, or deinonychus nesting sites at the edges of the savanna's, etc.

 

cheers,

 

-tid242

Reply #35 Top

Sigh, I'm looking forward to this like I was Elemental back in the day. Really looking good, Derek & Team, keep up the amazing work.

Once bitten twice shy, but it's really looking like I'm going to be getting the game I was expecting last year after all... it's just been a little delayed :)

Reply #36 Top

First this journal looks great and hopefully FE is great so i can have those who i told to buy Wom stop taunting me about the game..

I've never been one to go overboard about graphics, but Derek the one thing that really disconnected me from units in the game was the colours. 

  • Too much greys and purples used for units in game. Its almost as if there are only 2 colours used in differing shades..  the guardian statue and the unit of troops in pic 4 are really dull and boring looking.. especially on the dark tile set... really dull and boring looking.. especially on the dark tile set... please jazz them up colour wise to fit in with the colour map and other colourful monsters.. just because the tile set is bleak, doesnt mean those aligned should all be so too..
  • those stumpy dead trees need to be redone.. they really stand out in a bad way also.. too simple and stumpy and out of place against the rest of the tile set.. more skeleton type branches please..
  • the kingdom border is too finite... too square and harsh a line it looks unnatural a border.. either fade the border out and diffuse it and or change the kingdom border shape to give it more natural looking lines..
  • the rivers i would imagine are hard.. they look good but maybe some lighter colour plants next to the darker ones melding into the tile set just to diffuse the river line...

The UI looks much better though! Looking forward to more info.. :)

Reply #37 Top

My main request for the devs:

 

 

Play Master of Magic a few times from start to finish please, it might give you some ideas

Reply #38 Top

Thanks so much for the update! Tons of great new information and screens. I like everything I am reading and seeing so far. Really interested to see what other impact terrain has now...very cool to see rivers becoming useful and valuable.

 

I'm still dying to hear more about the overall realm and city management stuff that has been talked about.

Reply #39 Top

First thing I thought about when I read the journal (on the journalpage) I thought you talked from memory due to me not seeing the things you were talking about as they're not visible there.

 

About the strategic spellcasting. As another poster said, when you have casted the spell, have the camera zoom in to the caster like in Heroes V so you can see him cast the spell. Would be cool.

I don't got much to say. Can't find any errors. Maybe make the "attack", "train" and the other buttons that look the same, smaller and cooler.

 

If you are planning a graphicsjournal then I've got some questions but this is kinda close to it so I'm wondering if any ShaderModel 4.0 or higher effects are gonna be used. It was supposed to be in WoM but that's irrelevant now.

Reply #40 Top

Elemental, I finally get over you, move on.......and there you go pulling me right back in again!!!!!!!

 

 

looking forward to this.  I loved how in Fall From Heaven, the firs part of the game was 'player vs. the world' and then eventually became 'player vs other civs'.  looks like this will be similar.

Reply #41 Top

loving  the new screenshots, so colorful!

 

 

Reply #42 Top

The screen Shots are nice, and there seems to be improvement ... The only problem I see is that I might need a better computer to run the game. |-)

 

Color coding the map elements also makes it easier to identify what is on the map.

Reply #43 Top

Looking good, thanks for the update Derek!

One question... has the bug where items don't always show up in the cloth map screen been eradicated. It is one of the nastier ones in my opinion. Missing things near you just because you don't want to zoom into the high detail map is very annoying, and still exists to this day in E:WoM.

 

Reply #44 Top

Any chance to improve sovereign graphics - right now (in WoM and on these screenshots) they look worse than in good old MoM.

Reply #45 Top

Quoting Grrm, reply 44
Any chance to improve sovereign graphics - right now (in WoM and on these screenshots) they look worse than in good old MoM.
End of Grrm's quote

 

 This is honestly what bugs me the most about Elemental's graphics...

Reply #46 Top
Any chance to improve sovereign graphics - right now (in WoM and on these screenshots) they look worse than in good old MoM.

 

 This is honestly what bugs me the most about Elemental's graphics...

 

IN fact, 2D artwork is awesome except sometimes for the color tones. 3D artwork is ugly. I mean, when it's a small miniature on the map, it looks good, but when for example, you design your unit and you have a large picture of your unit, it really does not look nice. Maybe displaying smaller 3D pictures could make them look better.

Reply #47 Top

Nice work

Reply #48 Top

possible to have the fun of more than 200 exciting spells (including multiple level 5 spells) back in MOM days ?

Really miss the  sheer diversity

Reply #49 Top

It's nice to see the pretty stuff in the zoomed-in map and the minimap. But it would be cool to get some more practical map information - what has been done with the cloth map? Obviously it needs at least some additions to represent chasms and rivers.

Reply #50 Top

Quoting tid242, reply 34
I actually disagree (or in the least, don't agree with you, I might just be ambivalent), there is no reason in my mind why various ethnic groups shouldn't value some resources and underutilize others - this has been a recurring theme throughout our own (human) history wherby certain groups of people simply don't realize the value of resources that seem obvious to others (the polar expeditions by Europeans using horses (instead of sled dogs), or the Greenlandic/Vinlandic Norse refusing to eat seals, etc, etc). 

Designing resources in this way makes the game more interesting, and also requires more strategic decisions: do I build on top of a warg pit that I can't use simply to deny the enemy this resource?  If everyone could ride wargs the answer would be obvious, but if it's simply a tactic for resource denial, well, that's a more subtle question.

Personally, I wouldn't mind race-specific resources in the future - maybe the wraiths need access to willow-the-whisps that only reside in bogs, or Tarth requires protein shakes that only grow on protein-shake-trees, but no other races actually have any use for these (though perhaps they can develop tech to harvest them and then have the simply for trading (cornering the protein-shake-market might be lucrative if Tarth is in a position to dominate the map/game).

Just my thoughts...  if you want better mounts then perhaps there can be a unicorn or pegasis loft in the mountains that players can find (but empires cannot use), and likewise lycanthropic wargs, or deinonychus nesting sites at the edges of the savanna's, etc.
End of tid242's quote
YES!
And that would emulate other fantasy games. The factions may be majoritarily human but it doesn't prevent them to be culturally different. In Dom3, some factions rode on lizards, other on spiders, elephants, mammoths, a lot had horses and some hadn't any cavalry ability. In AoW, of course, there were also the boars, wyverns, eagles.
That could be related to the chosen faction or to the magic books of the sovereign or could be somewhere in the magic research tree or in the tech tree.
Lots of possibilities here but the most important is: differentiate the factions!!

(Hey: had someone told Derek about bear cavalry?)

-----------------------------

Otherwise, my concerns about the main UI are about the units and their utilization:
- auto-pathing showing when you want to move.
- ergonomy for group making. Enough of those tiny circles: make some 'table' appear with the units when you click on a group on the map, and allow us to select/deselect by a single click (ala AoW) or to make groups by click & drag (Dom3 style).

 

Graphics I like
And I noticed that the first green icon of the statue seems to be an elephant: AHA, the Trample ability, uh? ;)