Proximity of Opponents

from Elemental Forums

In recent game after game I have opponents within 15-20 tiles of me.  I waited to report until I was certain there was a pattern and it was not anomalous.  Trying to get free of the crowd... Game before last (v1.09r) I rolled a large map with 8 opponents.  I was sandwiched between two factions no further than 20 tiles away.  This last game (v1.09s) I rolled a large map with just 6 opponents yet I find one opponent 15 tiles away (from center capital tiles, not edge of borders).   I assume I would have had the second neighbor had it not been for the Mountains and Ocean.  This has been the norm.  Large maps with reduced # of opponents hasn't changed this.  Is this coded to be the norm?  Doesn't feel right having them so close everytime.  I don't want to be limited to early war every game.  But there is no room to expand.  I don't want to accept being boxed in.  But I also don't want to be getting two free cities so early.  Especially two Beacon of Hope + Shard cities. 

Is anyone else experiencing this?

 

Large Map, 6 Opponents

3,322 views 8 replies
Reply #1 from Elemental Forums Top

yeah I always have to declare war or have no 2nd city.

Reply #2 from Elemental Forums Top

I just rolled a large test map with 4 opponents and this time didn't get a neighbor.  But there was a resource cluster right about where a neighbor would be.  The cluster was two shards and a fertile.  Had it been a fertile, 1 shard, and a gold or something, I wonder if an opponent would have spawned there?  Makes me wonder if we get the near neighbors because resource clusters spawn near us?  If the cluster is choice enough, an AI is spawned in it?  I've no clue what parts of map spawns occur when.  Or if any normalization factors are present.  But if feels to me that map scripting needs a bit of improving.  It'd be my guess that it was always intended to be improved upon as other aspects of the game were stablized.  If so, then maybe now is the time for it.  ?

Sins of a Solar Empire II
Reply #3 from Elemental Forums Top

I only tried that once - 4 opponents - large map - 3 opponents where right up against me - and almost all resources on the map where located inside out zones or just outside - rest of the map was bare! - the last opponent only had his start resources and i had all the maps resourches with 5 cities total.

though i havent seen this in the new v1.09s version

Reply #4 from Elemental Forums Top

Yeah I've had a few of these too, the worst one is I spawn on an ISLAND with a pretty bare bones resource start and then find I can't even build a second city because literally 10 tiles north is Yithril (who had somehow gotten the sword of wrath 15 turns in o_O )

 

Although I think it almost runs a series of patterns when it spawns factions.  My most recent game saw ME sandwiching another faction (Capitar) against the ocean, and Altar and Magnar were each given 1/3 of the continent to themselves.

Reply #5 from Elemental Forums Top

Ya, I have played plenty of games where I am cut off by one or more AI's and yet 75% of the world is empty.

Now that we can't spell cheese it's really hard to do anything because of the ridiculous items AI's apparently start with.

Reply #6 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting Dsraider, reply 5
... 75% of the world is empty...
End of Dsraider's quote

 

This is actually the problem I have with most of my recent games the last few patches. I get a whole giant area with few resoures and large spaces between them, and have to work for over 100 turns to find an opponent.

Reply #7 from Elemental Forums Top

Same here.

Most of my worlds are rather boring. I get one or two opponents within a few tiles. Then a few scattered resources in various locations.

Ultimately, I end up going to war with the nearest ones within 50-60 tuns, usually wiping them off the mad (both extreme and hard difficulty, ridiculous is just too ridiculous). After that the locations where I would want to settle cities are blindingly obvious. Two fertiles + an clay pit, arcane lab plus a goldmine. Theres never any real decision or tradeoff, just race for the resource cluster as fast as you can; ignoring 90% of the world that is just empty space (hell, GalCiv felt more lively and that was actually set in SPACE!).

 

Reply #8 from Elemental Forums Top

I started another large map with 8 opponents.  Didn't have anyone in the 15-20 range this time.  But didn't have any resources either.  Nearest resources were once again at my neighbors capital.  Was just a bit further away this time.  This isn't good.  This is a big problem.  I think v1.1 needs to see a fix for this.  I think this fix supercedes feature lockdown.   The resource situation makes the game hollow.  Despite a whole bunch of awesome updates, I have enjoyed the v1.09e build better.  I certaintly played it a great deal more than all the later versions put together.  I don't want to say that because of all the great work the team has done.  It's really good stuff they've been doing.   But the resource problem undermines it all.  The map is the foundation of the game.  Everything happens on it.  A poor map script makes for a poor game.  The AI was weak in v1.09e, but there was reason to explore.  The player had early game choices to make.  Now the choice is limited to how you will prosecute the near obligatory war.  It's kind of like the Beacon of Hope building...  there is no other choice available.  It is obligatory.  Obligatory actions bite the big one.