ETA on 1.1
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Elemental Forums
Elemental Forums
So, where is it?
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36 replies
Updates normally come out on Friday. I doubt this update will be any earlier given Frogboy is still working on the AI for 1.1.
Stardock ForumsActually it's normally Thursdays, it's just here in the UK it's normally late Thursday night.
I think at this point "When it's done" is probably the most accurate response. Stardock has a lot riding on this patch, so I don't blame them for taking their time.
I agree with Mtn_Man. They have a fine line that they are going to ride between getting the update out and making sure it is right. I will still hold to my prediction of it being released in the first to weeks of December.
I'm just going to remind everyone that we will first see a BETA. I figure the world word should be said at least once in this thread.
Yes as you point out it's the Beta of 1.1 they are saying will "probably" be out this week, not 1.1 which will be out when they are happy it's ready for release as a finished patch.
Quoting KingHobbit, reply 7
I agree with Mtn_Man. They have a fine line that they are going to ride between getting the update out and making sure it is right. I will still hold to my prediction of it being released in the first to weeks of December.
End of KingHobbit's quote
Agree with KingHobbit who was agreeing with Mtn_Man.
I think first week in December is as good a guess as any, but they won't really know until the beta has been out there a while. I don't think it's really a fine line though, they just can't aford to release 1.1 in a buggy and unpolished state after the previous issues with Elementals luanch that would be the final nail in the coffin of the game.
But if people have to wait a few more weeks or even a month sure the boards will have lots of muttering and ranting but that will all be forgotten if they then release 1.1 and it's a really good solid patch.
Don't get me wrong, I am fine with a month or so for 1.1. If we start getting past Christmas, then I think there is a bigger problem.
Quoting KingHobbit, reply 12
Don't get me wrong, I am fine with a month or so for 1.1. If we start getting past Christmas, then I think there is a bigger problem.
End of KingHobbit's quote
I think if it doesn't come out this side of Christmas we will get as I say a few people on the board complaining about it but ultimatley if it comes out and is very solid and improves the games as much as it should I don't think any real damage would be done. Obviously if it takes 6 months or something that's a different matter.
Anyone who gets impatient can always join the beta. Myself I predict anytime from first week of december to the last week of January depending on how many issues the beta finds.
I don't mind how long it takes as long as it is working properly when its actually released.
I also hope that Stardock re-looks at how they handle the beta process. Using DropBox is fine for some of us to lodge issues but I think it would only be a very small percentage that could be bothered doing this way. Much better to have the game itself guide the users through the log and lodge process.
The more things it fixes and improves, the more we all will forgive on time. Its like a little equation.
It would make sense for Impulse to copy Valve's report a bug feature that Steam uses in Valve's games.
But if people have to wait a few more weeks or even a month sure the boards will have lots of muttering and ranting but that will all be forgotten if they then release 1.1 and it's a really good solid patch.
End of quote
I disagree with your point about mutterings on the forums. At this point, a lot of people are past this point and are simply shelving the game. Recently, impinc posted on two of his mods a message to this effect, underscoring a real sentiment within the greater community. When poster in September were upset about being paid beta testers, many people defended SD given that they were putting out regular patches and had stated their intention to put out 1.1 at the end of September to start fixing the design decisions players had problems with. Now, almost two months later, we no longer get regular patches and are being asked to take part in another beta. Personally, I would rather have regular small patches which gave the community something to look at and talk about, than wait months for some huge patch. Look at most of the threads on this forum now, most of them are just wish lists or comments about things we have no idea about beyond what the devs post.
Quoting kenata, reply 17
But if people have to wait a few more weeks or even a month sure the boards will have lots of muttering and ranting but that will all be forgotten if they then release 1.1 and it's a really good solid patch.
I disagree with your point about mutterings on the forums. At this point, a lot of people are past this point and are simply shelving the game. Recently, impinc posted on two of his mods a message to this effect, underscoring a real sentiment within the greater community. When poster in September were upset about being paid beta testers, many people defended SD given that they were putting out regular patches and had stated their intention to put out 1.1 at the end of September to start fixing the design decisions players had problems with. Now, almost two months later, we no longer get regular patches and are being asked to take part in another beta. Personally, I would rather have regular small patches which gave the community something to look at and talk about, than wait months for some huge patch. Look at most of the threads on this forum now, most of them are just wish lists or comments about things we have no idea about beyond what the devs post.
End of kenata's quote
Well said. I agree with you. I'm not necessarily shelving the game yet...but I imagine there are a lot of others who already have. I think the longer the wait for this patch goes on, the more people will stop playing it. Some may come back, and get into it again if 1.1 really is much better. Some will come back when the expansions come out. But I also think there are others who simply will not. Maybe it's too small of a percentage to worry about, who knows.
I think I made it worse for myself by being in the beta. I wasn't in for very long (since beta 3), but I think I actually played the game more when it was in beta than after release. The release wasn't as different as it was made out to be. So, I started modding, and spent literally hundreds of hours on this game between playing it, and modding it. I don't want to see what I've done go to waste, but at the same time, I don't want to have to almost re-write everything when a new huge patch comes out. There's already been a couple small patches that broke things in mods. I'm not complaining about the little things here. I guess I'm just mad at the whole situation. What can they do otherwise? Sometimes you have to break things to fix them. I've put so many hours into playing my mod to test it and try to strike a good balance. Now, I will have to do the same thing when 1.1 comes out. I don't like when a fun thing becomes tedious.
Quoting econundrum1, reply 5
Actually it's normally Thursdays, it's just here in the UK it's normally late Thursday night.
End of econundrum1's quote
And if you live in Australia it's Fridays 
I'd rather wait an extra month or two for the patch than suffer another wave of whining and overly-dramatic "goodbye" threads. I doubt Stardock is keen on repeating history by pulling the same mistake which led to the game's poor release.
I'd rather wait an extra month or two for the patch than suffer another wave of whining and overly-dramatic "goodbye" threads. I doubt Stardock is keen on repeating history by pulling the same mistake which led to the game's poor release.
End of quote
I completely agree, but the fact is that they are doing a lot of the exact same things with 1.1 that they did with the beta. They are saying some stuff but ultimately keeping the community in the dark through the entire dev process. I mean I am not saying that this is necessarily a bad thing, but it is ultimately unnecessary. Since release, they have put out both full release updates and pre-release updates. Honestly, I think if they put out a pre-release ("beta") patch out with all the current changes even without full testing, the community would be much better off. Modders would be able to have their mods ready for patch release instead of having to wait and see what breaks and regular players would be able to try the changes and give good honest feedback. Since they would be pre-release, only those players who go out of their way to get the raw patch would play them and you wouldn't have this up in arms situation at all since the community would have plenty of time to discuss the actual changes. Right now, all the community can do is debate about the small tidbits of information given in this post or that with most of the conversation revolving around how one believes the system works instead of how it does.
I think I made it worse for myself by being in the beta. I wasn't in for very long (since beta 3), but I think I actually played the game more when it was in beta than after release. The release wasn't as different as it was made out to be. So, I started modding, and spent literally hundreds of hours on this game between playing it, and modding it. I don't want to see what I've done go to waste, but at the same time, I don't want to have to almost re-write everything when a new huge patch comes out. There's already been a couple small patches that broke things in mods. I'm not complaining about the little things here. I guess I'm just mad at the whole situation. What can they do otherwise? Sometimes you have to break things to fix them. I've put so many hours into playing my mod to test it and try to strike a good balance. Now, I will have to do the same thing when 1.1 comes out. I don't like when a fun thing becomes tedious.
End of quote
This was one reason why I stopped Updated Weapons. It felt like every time a new patch would come out, I would have to go back and update each and every weapon. Though honestly the major reason was the same as every other mod, My team mate and I decided to wait until 1.1 to do another set of updates after 1.09 was released. After a couple of weeks of waiting, he eventually moved on to modding other games. I will admit I mod Elemental here and there, but usually it is just to answer a forum question.
Quoting kenata, reply 21
they are doing a lot of the exact same things with 1.1 that they did with the beta. They are saying some stuff but ultimately keeping the community in the dark through the entire dev process. I mean I am not saying that this is necessarily a bad thing, but it is ultimately unnecessary. Since release, they have put out both full release updates and pre-release updates. Honestly, I think if they put out a pre-release ("beta") patch out with all the current changes even without full testing, the community would be much better off. Modders would be able to have their mods ready for patch release instead of having to wait and see what breaks and regular players would be able to try the changes and give good honest feedback. Since they would be pre-release, only those players who go out of their way to get the raw patch would play them and you wouldn't have this up in arms situation at all since the community would have plenty of time to discuss the actual changes. Right now, all the community can do is debate about the small tidbits of information given in this post or that with most of the conversation revolving around how one believes the system works instead of how it does.
End of kenata's quote
I agree with the above. Stardock, can you seriously consider this?
Best regards,
Steven.
Quoting LujanD, reply 20
I'd rather wait an extra month or two for the patch than suffer another wave of whining and overly-dramatic "goodbye" threads. I doubt Stardock is keen on repeating history by pulling the same mistake which led to the game's poor release.
End of LujanD's quote
Unfortunately I have not play a game in about a month. 1.1 does have a lot of pressure on it to fix quite a few things. I do think the AI is going to have to come in stages after the release of 1.1. I agree with the above statement, but the longer it takes the more it is going to have to fix. I still wish there was some customization to the world itself. The changelog does not mention a couple things like that. I am still hopeful and I will load the patch as soon as its available.
Quoting kenata, reply 21
I completely agree, but the fact is that they are doing a lot of the exact same things with 1.1 that they did with the beta. They are saying some stuff but ultimately keeping the community in the dark through the entire dev process. I mean I am not saying that this is necessarily a bad thing, but it is ultimately unnecessary. Since release, they have put out both full release updates and pre-release updates. Honestly, I think if they put out a pre-release ("beta") patch out with all the current changes even without full testing, the community would be much better off. Modders would be able to have their mods ready for patch release instead of having to wait and see what breaks and regular players would be able to try the changes and give good honest feedback. Since they would be pre-release, only those players who go out of their way to get the raw patch would play them and you wouldn't have this up in arms situation at all since the community would have plenty of time to discuss the actual changes. Right now, all the community can do is debate about the small tidbits of information given in this post or that with most of the conversation revolving around how one believes the system works instead of how it does.
End of kenata's quote
Regarding the modder stuff, I disagree with you. Since literally anything can change between beta and non-beta of a patch, the time in between will not help me at all as a modder. For example, for the Elves mod, I have to copy xml for every building, every armorpiece, every tech (and the techtree), every weapon, every piece of clothing, every hairpiece, every accessory, make sure quest items can be worn, mounts ridden and so on. And that's one faction. I'm going to have to do the same thing with the Drota. There's no point doing all that work, which takes hours, just to have a mod invalidated a week later because 10-15 values changed.
Only very small mods can be updated to a beta patch and then not require further updates when the beta turns into non-beta.
Beta periods will probably be known as mod-less periods (for those that choose to test the beta).
This is all assuming there have been no changes to the structure of XML, or changes to how mods work. Nothing has been announced, so far. This is where I think a beta period may come in handy for modders, in the sense that we can see what has changed in the xml structure between old and beta versions. Then, when we are handed the appropriate XML at non-beta release, we know how to go about things efficiently.
Quoting kenata, reply 17
But if people have to wait a few more weeks or even a month sure the boards will have lots of muttering and ranting but that will all be forgotten if they then release 1.1 and it's a really good solid patch.
I disagree with your point about mutterings on the forums. At this point, a lot of people are past this point and are simply shelving the game. Recently, impinc posted on two of his mods a message to this effect, underscoring a real sentiment within the greater community. When poster in September were upset about being paid beta testers, many people defended SD given that they were putting out regular patches and had stated their intention to put out 1.1 at the end of September to start fixing the design decisions players had problems with. Now, almost two months later, we no longer get regular patches and are being asked to take part in another beta. Personally, I would rather have regular small patches which gave the community something to look at and talk about, than wait months for some huge patch. Look at most of the threads on this forum now, most of them are just wish lists or comments about things we have no idea about beyond what the devs post.
End of kenata's quote
I'd be willing to bet you those who shelve the game will get it out again when the major patches come out, especially if they hear that the patches fix the game and make it truly great.
While I agree the launch was very bad and I could understand people who thought they bought a finished game feeling like beta testers, we are where we are and stardock are still putting out patches it's just that big patches that are properly tested and QA'd take a little longer.
1.1 is a big patch because fixing major game mechanics has a knock on effect to everything else, so it just couldn't be done as a series of small patches without breaking the game further until all the small patches where out. Also many of the early weekly patches had bugs that broke other aspects of the game, because they didn't have time to properly QA them on that schedule.
bottom line is because of it's scope patch 1.1 is going to take a while and because it involves so many things it's sensible to beta test and a very bad idea to launch it before all the bugs are ironed out (as it was with the origional release). Personally I think 90% of those who have lost interest will be back if the patch is good and fixes the game. If it's rushed out and bad and breaks the game further more people will leave and also loose faith in future patches.
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