Ok one thing that needs to be fixed or removed ASAP

Are the silly messages that you need to declare war on X both X and X can do this.

Seriously its annoying AND sometimes it pops up so fast after doing other functions that you end up declaring war on someone you did not want to. Such messages are best left at the diplomatic table, not when you are out managing your empire. Also the AI needs to take into account your relationship with the faction they want you to attack, mainly the AI has been wanting me to kill off my own allies, or close friends! LOL seriously at least make those offers when your relationship stat with another faction is cool. Also having factions that I just met asking me to attack someone is also silly.

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Reply #1 Top

The messages alone are not silly. The silliness is that it happens every X turns and usually is sent by a few factions. Example. I'm in a war with F1. Every X turns F2 tells me to attack F3 and immediately F3 wants me to attack F2.

 

Another thing.

When I try to make the faction in the war I need to spend some gildars and/or diplomatic capital. But when they want me to get involved they don't offer me anything.

Reply #2 Top

Also, the AI never offers anything.  They say things like "oh we should sign a treaty."  So I'm like "okay," which takes me to the negotiation screen.  But all the treaties have a perception value of like 3,000 more than everything I could possibly offer so they refuse every possible deal I could possibly make.  Cant they just offer the treaty to me?!  Even better is when someone that really dislikes me notices that I have unmarried children and suggests that we arrange a royal marriage.  So I'm like "that's cool" and go to the negotiation screen, but when I propose the marriage there the other sovereign refuses.  "What makes you think I would force my family member to into a marriage with YOUR family?"  I dunno, maybe because you said it would be a good idea five seconds ago, perhaps?  Why even bother.  :|

Basically makes diplomacy impossible if their perceived value of treaties gets too high.

Reply #3 Top

I have to agree with everything said above.  Having factions ask me to join in a war against X every few turns without any actual incentive included just bugs me.  The worst is when either I am on good terms with faction X or the faction asking me to go to war is on good terms with X (these requests don't seem particularly related to relations between the requester and the proposed enemy).  Or when the smallest and weakest AI asks me, one of the most powerful factions, to go to war with another of the most powerful factions without so much as a bribe.  I mean really, you want me to smite your enemies then give me a reason besides asking nice.

Also, as JeffSteel said, this problem translates over to all diplomatic requests from the AI, treaties and marriage they ask for and then insist on obscene amounts of your gold to "balance" the deal they wanted.  And of course there's the "tech trade" requests... which are impossible.

Reply #4 Top

This will surely change as the AI is worked on. My bet is that much of this behaviour is initial place-holder code until a more meaningful algorithm is written. :)

Reply #5 Top

In the same vein is the diplo message from sov "x" saying we need to meet to do some treaties.  Then when i go to the window, the values are so lopsided that even if I gave everything to SOV x, it would still not be enough to agree to the proposed treaty.  happens alot.  Perhaps, a modifier could be thrown in;  When the other SOV initiates the meeting, it "values" the assets of the player more highly than when the player initiates the meeting. 

Reply #6 Top

Agree that these requests can be annoying but it seems that they've become less frequent with the more recent updates. At least it hasn't been every other turn in my current game. The imbalance in value does persists.

Something related that I've noticed is that alliance and treaty request seem equally likely to come from the Kingdom or Empire factions. I feel like the Kingdom factions should be more friendly toward and inclined to treat with other Kingdom factions and same-wise for Empire factions. I'm not suggesting that Kingdom/Empire alliances and treaties shouldn't be allowed but they should be more difficult and expensive. 

Reply #7 Top

Quoting toadfly, reply 6

Something related that I've noticed is that alliance and treaty request seem equally likely to come from the Kingdom or Empire factions. I feel like the Kingdom factions should be more friendly toward and inclined to treat with other Kingdom factions and same-wise for Empire factions. I'm not suggesting that Kingdom/Empire alliances and treaties shouldn't be allowed but they should be more difficult and expensive. 
End of toadfly's quote

 

Well, there is a bonus/malus for different faction/empire. If you treat with a Empire and you are an Empire, you have +1 due to your allegiance. Same thing for kingdom/kingdom. Otherwise, you have a -1 for your diplomacy.

Reply #8 Top

I'm also hoping for improved diplomacy as the game evolves. This isn't really a problem just with Elemental. Civ V's diplomacy is awful as well. I think Elemental actually has better diplomacy than Civ V, despite the flaws. It just needs to be refined and expanded in Elemental, whilst Civ V really needs to be reworked.

Reply #9 Top

+1 to basically everything here.

Reply #10 Top

The worst part is the window that comes up right in the middle of the screen is disruptive.  I could bear it if if were smaller, went straight to the point, had just the sovereigns head maybe, and off to the side.  All the windows that disrupt the visual field to offer minimal information, like with quests, bug me just as much.

Reply #11 Top

A requesting me to go to war against C while A never actually met C - check

Annoying pop-ups every other turn - check

Absurdly high perceived value from the other side - check

-----

 

Also this fake dichotomy between 'empire' and 'kingdom' should really be reflected as the philosophical or racial distinction it really is.  The struggle is between Mankind and the Fallen - not between political regimes.

 

 


G.

Reply #12 Top

The diplomacy part of the game is probably the single most broken bit. Deals are essentially impossible (except maybe a non-aggression pact or two) but fortunately the whole ugly mess can be safely ignored. Enjoy the rest of the game and hope for the best in 1.1.

As for the underlying struggle, near as I can tell it is between vanilla and french vanilla, with maybe a tapioca thrown in for variety (not).

Reply #13 Top

I don't have anything to add other than support. Call me arrogant, but if you want to waste my time with diplomacy and not bring anything to the table that makes sense, I will probably invade, loot and pillage you if you keep it up.

 

Reply #14 Top

I'll agree with everything posted here.  When an AI offers a peace treaty, its free which is cool.  But if I'm seriously overpowering them I'd like to get some extra gold or materials in the bargain.  When I sue for peace, it usually costs me an arm and a leg.  So I'd like the option to return the favor.

Reply #15 Top

I'll admit I found it strange when I met another faction who had a much bigger military than I had.

So they declared war on me. A while later, that faction (whom I am still at war with) tells me this other faction (which I have never met) is getting

too powerful and that I should declare war on them. #:(