Heroes and their uses

I've been playing several games up to 3-4 hundred turns and so far I've barely used any Adventurer heroes besides my sovereign and his offsprings.  It's already quite the micromanagement hassle to move these about without having several others to lvl up and upgrade and equip.  Aside from the specialist heroes (farmers, administrator, etc) I find no use for the simple Adventurer type.  Am I missing something?

 

Also, might I suggest to have a right-click radial menu on each unit for the actions rather than the task bar type interface?

 

 


G.

12,062 views 15 replies
Reply #1 Top

I like to hire a few champions early on in the game to use as scouts. They are really the ultimate scouts (especially the Adventurer champions for the extra movement) for several reasons:

1) They can collect notables which means they can pay for themselves easily. Units can't

2) They can run away this is a big deal for any scout, regular units can't and will eventually just die because something attacks them.

3) Generally they will be hired at the borders of your explored area meaning turns aren't wasted running them out to where they need to be.

4) Turns/materials are not wasted producing them so you can focus on settlers or actual military units.

5) Their cost is generally really low (don't hire the expensive ones just to scout) especially when you compare it to a unit that won't suffer from 2).

6) Their use never expires, there's always new notables for them to fetch and carry (unless you never research notables later in the game), even top of the line units eventually suffer from 2).

 

I do think it's kind of sad that the best argument I can make for most champions is they're over-glorified gophers but I work with what I'm given.

 

Edit: I've also seen lots of arguments for high intelligence heroes being imbued for massive caster armies, but that brings back the equipping/leveling dilemma and gimps your sovereign's casting until you start getting a temple of essence in a few cities, or you mass level which can be difficult with the monster spawn reduction compared to earlier game builds.

Reply #2 Top

Missed quite a lot it seems - thank you.

 

 

G.

Reply #3 Top

Also

A "bare" hero can be a reasonably cheap garrison unit.  And when an attack seems imminent, buying him a bunch of stuff is the fastest way to bulk-up a small garrison to fight something off.  Dreadfully expensive, but still the fastest way.

 

Reply #4 Top

I had an idea here to try and make another use for adventurers and all other hero types.

Currently, it is also worth noting that the adventurer type hero seems to be the most likely to have a special power (Crushing blow, Ice blast, Vengeance, etc...), and tend to have higher starting physical stats.

Reply #5 Top

I employ many heros and make most of them mages then attach them to other unit stacks. Also you have to use a hero for the Quest and notables.

Reply #6 Top

Well I never use units, just heroes. The adventuer heroes have awesome stats and/or special abilities like crush or vengance.

Reply #7 Top

Hire them all, embue them all, go kill a load of spiders & wolves, level up essence to 10(ish), research spell level 5 (I think), summon an Ice Lord each, win game...

:D :D :D :D :D :D

Reply #8 Top

I've been playing several games up to 3-4 hundred turns and so far I've barely used any Adventurer heroes besides my sovereign and his offsprings.  It's already quite the micromanagement hassle to move these about without having several others to lvl up and upgrade and equip.  Aside from the specialist heroes (farmers, administrator, etc) I find no use for the simple Adventurer type.  Am I missing something?

 

Also, might I suggest to have a right-click radial menu on each unit for the actions rather than the task bar type interface?

 

 


G.
End of quote

I have a whole slew of imbued leaders. In the game I have going now, turn 350, I have 15 or so leaders capable of magic use, probably 40 other leaders. Most of these are city-based only. Other adventurers I find useful in getting to the goodie huts which are usually spread all over the map. Leaders with longbows are actually fairly good combat units. I try to arm my magic guys with longbows, so they're still useful at low mana levels which will inevitably occur. With the changes to wandering monsters in 1.08, most of my leaders don't have stuff. Only two or three have bows and maybe a third have some trinket from the item shop. Most have traveling boots, at 10 bucks it's the only reasonably-priced item in the shop. 

Reply #9 Top

Primarily, I use my heroes/champions as imbued spellcasters (which takes some patients to become useful, but is worth it), scouts / notable location 'gophers' as mentioned above, and garrisoned to keep creatures etc. from preying upon my cities as well as to make use of their admin/farming abilities.  Lots of this has been said above.  Merchant master, etc. abilities aren't much on their own but over time as you get more heroes I think it does add up (although this is another point -- has anyone noticed that late game they might have TONS of heroes, but the AI opponents have like 1 or 2 pretty often??).

 

What I am very unhappy about regarding heroes is their complete lack of use in direct combat (even the ones with the specialty powers like crushing blow -- which are VERY limited in their scope by the way, I hope many different types and more interesting powers are on their way).  Even late game, maybe especially late game, heroes simply don't have the hitpoints to stand up to anything in direct combat.  If I pump all their level-up points into constitution, then they lose whatever strength or dexterity edge they might have gained.  I completely understand that just any hero shouldn't be able to take down a powerful unit alone, but shouldn't SOME (with proper development and leveling) be able to stand up to some pretty powerful creatures without being killed so easily?  I've found that even high level heroes with powerful weapons and armor are 100% useless for melee fighting in almost all cases.  Being able to pop off a specialty attack or two might be nice, but shouldn't a hero I've developed to be a fighter also be able to stand up and kill a powerful creature with its sword, etc?

Reply #10 Top

My main gripe with champions is the fact that they can only gain XP via combat and they can never increase their non-combat abilities. If I have a sage or a merchant stationed in a settlement for hundreds of turns, it only seems reasonable that the champion would get better at research, trade, farming, etc.

Reply #11 Top

Quoting GW, reply 10
My main gripe with champions is the fact that they can only gain XP via combat and they can never increase their non-combat abilities. If I have a sage or a merchant stationed in a settlement for hundreds of turns, it only seems reasonable that the champion would get better at research, trade, farming, etc.
End of GW's quote

 

I would support this in a heartbeat. In any of the total war series (Best RTS of all time) allows non-combat characters to level up by doing what they are meant to do. For instance, a spy will level by spying successfully. A merchant levels up slightly each turn they are trading etc. The abilities besides adventurer really seem less meaningful in the later portions of the game. This also goes with the same perks we can pick as sovereign.

Reply #12 Top

Quoting Uriel1980, reply 9

What I am very unhappy about regarding heroes is their complete lack of use in direct combat (even the ones with the specialty powers like crushing blow -- which are VERY limited in their scope by the way, I hope many different types and more interesting powers are on their way).  Even late game, maybe especially late game, heroes simply don't have the hitpoints to stand up to anything in direct combat.  If I pump all their level-up points into constitution, then they lose whatever strength or dexterity edge they might have gained.
End of Uriel1980's quote

 

It would be nice if hit points were increase every time a hero levels-up and constitution added a bonus/penalty like in most RPGs.

Reply #13 Top

I am pretty sure they are currently working on making champions more useful.

Reply #14 Top

My main gripe with champions is the fact that they can only gain XP via combat and they can never increase their non-combat abilities. If I have a sage or a merchant stationed in a settlement for hundreds of turns, it only seems reasonable that the champion would get better at research, trade, farming, etc.
End of quote

Yes.  Well, not quite my main gripe, just one of several.

Reply #15 Top

I buy everyone I can. The bonuses all stack so it starts to add up. And, they seem to be worth more militarily in the AI eyes. And, if you band them together as a party and with other units, they do pretty well even into the mid game.