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Hmm, that's it? Really?

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Hmm, that's it? Really?

from Elemental Forums

Been playing around with the Beta, and I have to admit that I'm a bit disappointed.

 

Elemental has a fantastic concept, but it just seems to fall way behind when compared to other games in the Genre.

 

1) The tech-trees

Nice concept, but there's only what? 20 Warfare, 15 Civic, 8 Adventure and Magic and 5 Diplomatic techs, bringing this in at less than 70 techs across the whole gamut? Isn't that a bit few? I was hoping for massive tech-trees a la Civilization or the school of spells with Dominions. I want to be forced to specialize, instead I get the feeling that everyone will research the same ten techs in the initial rounds.

 

2) Magic spells

Where exactly is the difference between fire, air, ice, earth and water magic? Ice looks like fire in blue. I'm a bit underwhelmed with the whole magic system - it seems rushed and unfinished and the spells are not very interesting. I think Age of Wonders did a better job in giving the spell-classes more individuality.

 

3) Tactical Combat

Ugh. Maybe I'm missing something, but there's three things very, very wrong with the combat system. First, it favours the attacker in a ridiculous, gamebreaking way by letting him move first, which means a spellcaster wipes out half of the defending army. Or your archers do, in case spellcasting in combat gets (hopefully) fixed. Why can't individual units attack by their combat speed/initiative, a la HOMM? Secondly, spellcasting in tactical combat is just wrong. A first level caster with a level 2 attack spell can cast three times a round. Even at Int 10, this averages to 15 damage (up to 30) per round, unavoidable, and before the defender gets to act. This means you can instakill a level 5 sovereign who did nothing but spec for Constitution and survivability, without giving him the chance to retaliate. I think a much, much better solution would be to only allow one casting action per round. And finally - kiting! It can't be that I can just stand around and happily one-shot enemies that come close without ever being in any danger. Units deal way too much damage and have way too little hitpoints - changing damage and hitpoints might make combat more interesting.

 

4) Customization of Sovereign and Units

The Sovereign customization is really nice, though I wish that race would do something. Like giving allegiance bonus or dislikes, or other benefits/disadvantages. Again, I'm underwhelmed with the units though. I can only grant them more hitpoints by putting a magical backpack on them? Really? Let alone that a damage-soaking unit is not necessary unless fighting against enemy spellcasters (who'd never target them anyway). I would love if I could slap special abilities on units and have some proper interesting ones like in MoM or AoW.

 

 

I'm not even going into quests, goodie huts etc which absolutely lack in randomization.

 

So, overall - I pre-ordered Elemental,  but what I'm seeing in the Beta leaves me disappointed as in a "Yeah, this is nice, yeah, I'll play two or three games, oh, Civ V is coming out and has real depth"-way - which, as the self-proclaimed spiritual child of Masters of Magic is a real real shame, because I should be all over this game drooling from here to the next Water Node.

 

Seriously though, just make tactical combat more interesting/less broken and I'll be a lot happier. I can't see that happen until the 24th though, or whenever you guys print your gold discs.

 

 

By the way, please feel free to show me the error of my ways and point out what exactly I'm missing.

elemental
25,498 views 28 replies
Reply #26 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting Annatar11, reply 22

Tactical battles most definitely should've came in an earlier beta, it still needs a bit of work to make "very fun" - though at the moment most of the un-funness comes from there being virtually no balance (one hit kills all around, spells that do way too much damage, armor being way more costly than weapons, etc). The mechanics could still use some work, but it looks like they're planning on that for one of the first patches.
End of Annatar11's quote

Yeah but don't forget that for months, Stardock has been telling the tactical battles would be real time/continuous turns. A lot of people, me included, have been badly disappointed by the switch to a turn-based system. With a very good Turn- based gameplay, i may have changed my mind but after reading all the comments about tactical combat, i am quite sceptical.

Reply #27 from Elemental Forums Top

I'm just gonna say, I hear folks concerns. And I recommend you go back and watch some of my earlier videos for Beta 2. And see how very far the game has come along.

Absolutely ... amazing. I'm not saying that anyone's concerns are not valid. I just think that with the time they've put in to the game and how very far it has come along. That by the time it is visible on Day 0. We'll all be blown away.

Now that's not to say that there isn't a LOT more that can be done with the game, and will once she's live. But for now.. this is a powerful game.

Galactic Civilizations IV
Reply #28 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting ddd888, reply 24

Quoting Spitz, reply 20I share your concerns, but. . .


since the game is now irreversibly committed to the release date, the most productive use of our time, typing, thought and effort at this point is to help make the game better through suggestions, constructive feedback and bughunting.


 

its what i am doing and most of other users

taking 2 min to express our concern isnt really affecting the game
End of ddd888's quote

While I am pretty immune to criticism, I can tell you that complaint threads like this just suck the life out of the development team.

Constructive criticism is helpless. Pointless bitching is not.  

You'd be surprised how much impact beta testers can have both good (in terms of getting their ideas into the game) and bad (sucking the life out of the team).  

I've already posted considerably on my dislike of the magic system and that it needs to change before release.  I would love to hear more *specific* ideas on the game.

Incidentally,l you can upgrade the HP on your units, you train them as veterans or elite and such and it gives them significant HP bonuses.