Legendary NERF'S

By on May 7, 2013 12:05:42 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

MM77

Join Date 03/2003
+1

 Encumbrance removal is by FAR the GRANDADDY of ALL Legendary NERF'S. This one change made horse's , warg's , assasin's, battle mage's and much more.USELESS! This is far worse than EXP split or Battle placement at the beginning of battle. Ref, all troops should start as in F.E. enough space to BUFF and organize strategy before battle.But back to topic...

1.Before  Encumbrance removal F.E.L.H. was easily my favorite game, with it out F.E. is now my favorite.

2.By taking DODGE off wargs, assasin's and mage's do not have enough dodge to stay alive on tougher levels.

3.You can't make battle mage's any more because you added armour requirements.

4.Encumbrance allowed you to juggle how you wanted to build a hero within weight limits which was more strategy and FUN!

5.I could go on and on but I won't...I will ALWAYS LOVE STARDOCK and F.E.

6.I PRAY that if you update F.E. you only add HEROS and MAPS and NONE of these new balances or Legendary NERF'S.

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tjashen
May 7, 2013 12:39:07 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Ummm...you can't really nerf a whole game (or can you?)  But I digress...

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May 7, 2013 9:11:54 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

What maddening use of apostrophes. 

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May 7, 2013 9:16:05 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I do think there is a point on melee heroes not being tough enough.

 

Wondering if defenders should be +2 hp per level, and warriors/assassins +1hp per level.

 

 

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May 7, 2013 11:12:01 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I think Defenders should get Plate as an inherent ability on picking the class, Warriors should get Chain in the same way. Commanders should get to pick them relatively soon. It's irritating to find a bunch of chain or plate early in the game from "goodie huts" knowing that you won't be able to use it until mid-game+ when you can make your own anyway, plus it will help make them not so squishy early on. Probably wouldn't hurt to give them a piece or two of their related armor as well.

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May 7, 2013 12:16:43 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I say remove the tree prereqs to get to chain/plate. Instead of forcing me to choose traits I don't want (Enmity, defender) to get the trait I do, just de-branch it and give it a level requirement.

That way, when you find that shiny armor, you can decide to spend your next trait point to use the armor you found. Now, if you find that nice armor, you have to re-plan your next 3-4 trait choices. Which ruins a lot of the fun of progressing up the trait tree. 

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May 7, 2013 12:31:33 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

i think they armor proficiencies are in their current spots for a reason. the defender gets plate in the "tank" tree, which makes sense. why would you use plate when you're not going to use him as a tank? in a support role, the extra initiative penalty only makes him worse, not better.

the lower tree for the warrior looks more like your typical "glass cannon" line, so it's probably a balance decision to put the armor traits in the other branch. chain armor is easy enough to grab either way if you really want it.

the placement for assassin seems a bit arbitrary. i would have expected it at the end of the dodge line, tbh.

for commanders, it makes sense to have it in the commander tree - administrators really don't need armor.

 

 

 

 

 

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May 7, 2013 12:45:55 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Azunai_,

i think they armor proficiencies are in their current spots for a reason. the defender gets plate in the "tank" tree, which makes sense. why would you use plate when you're not going to use him as a tank? in a support role, the extra initiative penalty only makes him worse, not better.

the lower tree for the warrior looks more like your typical "glass cannon" line, so it's probably a balance decision to put the armor traits in the other branch. chain armor is easy enough to grab either way if you really want it.

the placement for assassin seems a bit arbitrary. i would have expected it at the end of the dodge line, tbh.

for commanders, it makes sense to have it in the commander tree - administrators really don't need armor.

 

 

 

 

 

 

With the commander you have a choice of the administration path and the commander/general type path. The armor should be available if you choose the latter path. 

 

BTW - I do prefer the encumbrance system and I do agree the game is still recovering from its removal. The armor proficiency should have its own tree and could be level restricted for balance as has been suggested. I hate having to choose several traits I do not want just to be able to use better armor.  I also think the path to plate armor is too long for heroes causing them to be less heroic as the game progresses and technology leaves them behind.

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May 7, 2013 12:48:13 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

that's exactly how the game works?! chain proficiency for commander is a branch from the main commander tree (the troop accuracy/initiative/battle cry line)

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May 7, 2013 12:52:28 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting davrovana,
I say remove the tree prereqs to get to chain/plate. Instead of forcing me to choose traits I don't want (Enmity, defender) to get the trait I do, just de-branch it and give it a level requirement.

That way, when you find that shiny armor, you can decide to spend your next trait point to use the armor you found. Now, if you find that nice armor, you have to re-plan your next 3-4 trait choices. Which ruins a lot of the fun of progressing up the trait tree. 

That's a start.

Putting Encumbrance back in the game as it was or Putting armor trait in the GENARAL traits would make me LOVE F.E.L.H. AGAIN!

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May 7, 2013 12:56:49 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I guess, encumbrance trolls are the new dynasty trolls.

statigy

I'm struggling to figure out if that's a typo or if you actually mean that more meaningless statistics = more fun.

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May 7, 2013 1:04:41 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I'm personally very happy they took out encumbrance. It was an unnecessary mechanic to accomplish restrictions that could be achieved in other ways. Now, some of the nerfing of other things may need to be reviewed, but there are still a few weeks left prior to release. I'm continually amazed at Derek's ability to identify weak points in the game and make them better. He'll continue to do that.

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May 7, 2013 1:21:47 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting sweatyboatman,
I guess, encumbrance trolls are the new dynasty trolls.

statigy

Thank you .. I forgot to use spell checker. the word is  strategy.

P.S. I have seen no TROLLS in this post so far. I have seen what Frogboy and the BETA screen asked for and that's CONSTRUCTIVE CRITSIZIUM to hopefully make this the BEST game it can be.

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May 7, 2013 1:47:56 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting sweatyboatman,
I guess, encumbrance trolls are the new dynasty trolls.

That really is a low blow. Calling people trolls won't help the conversation.

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May 7, 2013 2:03:23 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Lord Reliant,
I'm personally very happy they took out encumbrance. It was an unnecessary mechanic to accomplish restrictions that could be achieved in other ways. Now, some of the nerfing of other things may need to be reviewed, but there are still a few weeks left prior to release. I'm continually amazed at Derek's ability to identify weak points in the game and make them better. He'll continue to do that.

I see how it may be BETTER for some players like yourself and that's ok with me.

The problem I have is my mage cannot have heavy armor anymore and he cannot buy a warg for DODGE. this makes him so squishy that without embellishing. I like F.E. better it's more fun for me. I wish I could feel the same way about F.E.L.H.

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May 7, 2013 2:20:48 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

seriously? you want encumbrance back so your mage can wear heavy armor? if that's so important to you, just mod the game and put heavy armor proficiency in your mage tree. problem solved.

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May 7, 2013 2:29:07 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Azunai , will you help me? please write or paste the steps on how to do that.

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May 7, 2013 2:52:54 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Yeah, I want to know where the code is to add encumberance back in too.  Last time I checked the .str and .def files there was no trigger for this.

And, we've discussed to death how you balance this for mages.  Add a mana/spellcasting penalty for medium and heavy armors.  Soaking up trait slots for armor when there are so many traits already, and where level advancement is so slow, is just silly.

All this accomplished was making heroes less legendary, and units comparably even more powerful.

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May 7, 2013 3:13:25 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting MM77,

Azunai , will you help me? please write or paste the steps on how to do that.

i don't have much experience with modding, so i just tried the most obvious solution without cheching tutorials or anything. seems to work. 

i don't know how to make a proper mod, so i basically just "hacked" the game XML file that contains the relevant information. i think save games store the XML data, which means it will only work on a new game.

step 1: find the relevant file; on my machine (win7 64bit) that's the file

"CoreAbilities.XML" in "C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\FE Legendary Heroes\data\English"

step 2: make a backup copy of the file; if something goes wrong, you can delete your failed attempt and replace it with the backup.

step 3: open that file with a text editor. i recommend the freeware tool "Notepad++", that's a basic text editor with options to XML tags and similar stuff; any other text  processor will work, though - the default windwos notepad will get the job done

step 4: technically, you would now look for the Plate ability and essentially copy & paste the ability of the warrior or defender and rewrite some of the tags so it works for mage. you don't have to do that, since i already did. just copy the following section:



<AbilityBonus InternalName="ArmorProficiency2Ability_Mage">
<AbilityBonusType>Unit_Level</AbilityBonusType>
<AbilityBonusOption InternalName="ArmorProficiency2Ability_Mage">
<DisplayName>Plate Mail Proficiency</DisplayName>
<Description>Allows the unit to wear Plate Mail armor</Description>
<Icon>Ability_PlateMailProficiency_Icon.png</Icon>
<PerkTreePosX>0</PerkTreePosX>
<PerkTreePosY>2</PerkTreePosY>
<GameModifier>
<ModType>Unit</ModType>
<Attribute>AdjustUnitStat</Attribute>
<StrVal>UnitStat_ArmorProficiency</StrVal>
<Value>1</Value>
<Provides>Allows the unit to wear Plate Mail armor</Provides>
</GameModifier>
<Type>Defensive</Type>
<UpgradePathID>ArmorProficiency</UpgradePathID>
<Prereq>
<Type>AbilityBonusOption</Type>
<Target>Unit</Target>
<Attribute>PathOfTheMage</Attribute>
</Prereq>
<AIData AIPersonality="AI_General">
<AIPriority>0</AIPriority>
</AIData>
</AbilityBonusOption>
</AbilityBonus>


step 5: insert the new ability in the file. that's the tricky part. it doesn't really matter where exactly you paste it, but you must make sure that it's between the end of one ability and the beginning of the next. if you mess up that structure, the file probably won't load and the game may hang up or crash or whatever.

find the end of an ability, indicated by

</AbilityBonus>

and insert the new ability between that tag and the beginning of the next ability, indicated by


<AbilityBonus InternalName="blabla">

step 6: save the file

step 7: start LH, start a new game; i recommend you make a custom hero and give him the "veteran" trait so you get your first level up instantly to verify whether it worked. pick path of the mage and you should see plate armor proficiency as a new trait, available right at the start (you could probably play around with that stuff to give it another prerequisite. if you think it's too good for level 3, just be disciplined and pick it later )

let me know if it worked


btw: if one of the experienced modders gives you a better description, just follow them; as i said, i'm not experienced with that stuff. in fact, that's my first "mod"
 

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May 7, 2013 3:31:28 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting tjashen,

Yeah, I want to know where the code is to add encumberance back in too.  Last time I checked the .str and .def files there was no trigger for this.

I believe the mod is called FallenEnchantress.exe.

I may go back soon, and see how different the two have truly become.

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May 7, 2013 3:42:51 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

inflammatory title - check

poor punctuation & spelling - check

improper and erratic use of capitalization - check

I don't think my categorization is a inappropriate.

Encumbrance has been kicked around repeatedly on these forums.  Some like it.  Some don't.  (Some can't figure out why putting a 90lb weakling on a horse makes them capable of wielding a great axe).  Whatever, it's gone.

Like dynasties, it's a feature they could never get to work quite right and so they junked it.  And like dynasties, some people will never let it go.

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May 7, 2013 3:49:20 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting davrovana,


Quoting tjashen, reply 17
Yeah, I want to know where the code is to add encumberance back in too.  Last time I checked the .str and .def files there was no trigger for this.



I believe the mod is called FallenEnchantress.exe.

I may go back soon, and see how different the two have truly become.

 

Actually, it's called LH 0.75...

Tell me where I can download that.

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May 7, 2013 3:55:30 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Azunai , THANK YOU very MUCH!!!!  I'll try it!   

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May 7, 2013 5:26:34 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

IMO armor proficiencies should be general traits. 1 level slot for each type of armor usage. this would enable anyone to use any armor thought it may cost a level for each item type to your character.

also if you choose defender you should get plate for free; warrior/assassin = chain free; mage = magic armor free. i realize there would have to be some additional mage armor created for this to work but it shouldnt be difficult.

it sounds like people want to be able to customize more. i am with this movement. its why playing in the sandbox is so fun in the first place.

 

** also please stop wasting peoples time by criticizing spelling and grammar. if you know what they mean just answer the question. people are trying to share their ideas and make the game better. if i want an english lesson i can enroll in my local college.

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May 7, 2013 5:31:59 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Hey lpisko, I'll never criticize your grammar!  It's easy to miss spelling stuff when responding on the fly, so people should just chill... we are here to enjoy Elemental, not be grammar nazis!

If I can't make out the words, though, I'll ask.  In your case, I get your meaning so no worries!

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May 7, 2013 6:44:52 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

You know what I want to see as a DLC? Dynasties!

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