Please Fix! AI player can autoraze cities after capture, whereas we have to wait five turns.

By on March 3, 2013 1:53:30 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

StevenAus

Join Date 06/2010
+108

We are not allowed to raze captured cities for 5 turns.  But the AI players (not monsters or denizens, but actual players) can autoraze cities immediately on capture.  I've lost three towns in about 30 turns in a big empire because they raze immediately (and I couldn't teleport there because it was ex-wildlands and that is consider "occupied" by enemy).  They should follow the same rules with razing as human players - if they want to raze it, wait five turns.

Locked Post 30 Replies
Search this post
Subscription Options


Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 3, 2013 6:49:33 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Hmm is this still happening I thought it was fixed maybe...  Well if so that's a real bummer... this is one of the more annoying glitches.

Stardock - pls take a look at fixing this one next patch!

Thanks.

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 3, 2013 9:00:35 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

This is working as designed to give the AI player an advantage Also even wandering npc's and monsters an animals can do it too. This makes the player HAVE to DEFEND his territory instead of running willy nilly out there leaving his rear undefended or with very little defense. Serves you right now you'll learn to protect your rear. No "RELOADING" a saved game now to cheat. hehe

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 3, 2013 11:33:26 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

@Willie - if you don't have anything constructive to say then don't fill the forum with garbage, it's really getting a bit tiresome.  Adding a smiley face to your post doesn't make it humorous or any less annoying.  In particular in this case, the post is in in the Support area where we want it taken seriously. 

This is not working as designed, Frogboy stated some time ago that the 5 turn limit was added as the UI level and he hadn't had a chance to apply it to the AI.  There has been no indication from anyone at Stardock that this is how it's supposed to be, ie. to give the AI player an advantage.

Frankly, this is a really annoying issue/bug.  Just search the forums and you'll see it's been pointed out before.  

 

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 3, 2013 1:10:27 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting abob101,
@Willie - if you don't have anything constructive to say then don't fill the forum with garbage, it's really getting a bit tiresome.  Adding a smiley face to your post doesn't make it humorous or any less annoying.  In particular in this case, the post is in in the Support area where we want it taken seriously. 

This is not working as designed, Frogboy stated some time ago that the 5 turn limit was added as the UI level and he hadn't had a chance to apply it to the AI.  There has been no indication from anyone at Stardock that this is how it's supposed to be, ie. to give the AI player an advantage.

Frankly, this is a really annoying issue/bug.  Just search the forums and you'll see it's been pointed out before.  

 

 

Umm last I looked you aren't any kind of MODERATOR so you can keep your don't post anything bs to yourself because I ain't gonna do it. Got it? Thanks The AI razing when it want's to is not an issue with me because I PROTECT myself, but, you crybaby losers want everything in YOUR favor. So, I see no need to fix anything...WAD and I'm happy about it.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 3, 2013 1:48:38 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

One of the selling points of FE is an AI that doesn't get to cheat.  The AI being able to insta-raze is cheating.

 

Personally, I'd like to see raze times dependent on the level of the city, and monsters be unable to raze lvl 2 cities, just lower them a level per turn and destroying buildings.  (one potential exploit would be the 2000 gold level 5 town improvement and being razed, but that's something that probably wouldn't be used)

 

 

 

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 3, 2013 2:13:37 PM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

Quoting abob101,
@Willie - if you don't have anything constructive to say then don't fill the forum with garbage, it's really getting a bit tiresome.  Adding a smiley face to your post doesn't make it humorous or any less annoying.  In particular in this case, the post is in in the Support area where we want it taken seriously. 

This is not working as designed, Frogboy stated some time ago that the 5 turn limit was added as the UI level and he hadn't had a chance to apply it to the AI.  There has been no indication from anyone at Stardock that this is how it's supposed to be, ie. to give the AI player an advantage.

Frankly, this is a really annoying issue/bug.  Just search the forums and you'll see it's been pointed out before.  

 

 

@abob101 Yeah where do you get off telling other people what they can or can't say? You're just a troll and you should get off if you want to play that game.

As far as the AI being able to raze when it chooses I like that as well even if it is a bug. Perhaps they may see it as a perk to the AI at higher levels? I could go for that.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 3, 2013 3:00:23 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

also,

AI getting insta war from NA pact is something I had. I can't break NA pact, and I don't see THE NUMBER OF TURNS I HAVE LEFT TO be able to declare war.

 

Please check first (dont know if 1.32 now gives same rules to AI and player)

and please add a number shown to the second.

AL.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 3, 2013 8:46:24 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums


Agreed! AI should have to wait for 5 turns as well!

Monsters should have to wait for 5 turns as well!! In this case, the monster 'stakes' out the town, terrorizing it. You have 5 turns to vanquish the creature or the town becomes sacked, and turns into a spawning lair of that monster type.

 

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 4, 2013 12:06:55 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Good point about the Monsters/Denizens.  I would like that too.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 4, 2013 12:49:24 AM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

This should work as is on higher difficulties. Nice extra feature an ability for the ai on say Hard difficulty and above.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 4, 2013 6:57:37 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting willie sanderson,

This is working as designed to give the AI player an advantage Also even wandering npc's and monsters an animals can do it too. This makes the player HAVE to DEFEND his territory instead of running willy nilly out there leaving his rear undefended or with very little defense. Serves you right now you'll learn to protect your rear. No "RELOADING" a saved game now to cheat. hehe

Realoading is the most powerful spell ever.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 4, 2013 6:59:43 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I don't reload, unless I get a dud starting area (or the game crashes ).

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 4, 2013 4:54:05 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I like to watch myself for the urge to reload. It's usually an indication that I did something that I knew I shouldn't (tried to take the easy way out) and got caught like I knew I would. Heh. My rule is that I only allow myself to reload over a specific case of being dumb once.

I think that razing should be the same, human player or computer. That question aside entirely, of course there should be consequences for leaving the rear unattended. If you can't be strong everywhere, it's a much more compelling choice to have to make to choose where you will concentrate and where you will be stretched thin.

I'd rather see your potential opponents strongly incented to attack you where you are weak, rather than just be able to raze a city instantly if a player can not use that same tactic.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 5, 2013 9:03:05 AM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

Quoting StevenAus,
I don't reload, unless I get a dud starting area (or the game crashes ).

Cheating is still cheating no matter what the excuse unless it is a crash and that is IF it is a crash and not just an excuse.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 5, 2013 9:44:03 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I don't get this thing where lately there's a few guys suggesting that reloading a game is somehow cheating...??  Who the heck are they cheating by reloading?  If someone wants to reload a game for whatever reason then that's their call... no-one is playing their game but them.  It's a rather derogatory term that I don't personally think is necessary.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 5, 2013 10:02:00 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I actually would not mind if I was allowed to instant raze. But yea, if I can't then the AI shouldn't be allowed to either. I actually haven't noticed it doing it recently. Monsters yes, but not the AI.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 5, 2013 10:31:52 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

If you look in ElementalDefs.xml, you find this:

<OwnershipTurnsBeforeCanRaze>5</OwnershipTurnsBeforeCanRaze>

So presumably if you did want to try playing with insta-raze... just change this to zero and you're probably good to go.   

 

I think the key thing is that it should be consistent  i.e. same for AI as it is for the player.  Frogboy all but admitted it was a bug in another thread, this one:

http://forums.elementalgame.com/439893

In fact reading that again now, he actually said "It's on my list.", so hopefully it's still on his list because this one has been complained about quite a bit.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 6, 2013 1:21:46 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting psychoravin,


@abob101 Yeah where do you get off telling other people what they can or can't say? You're just a troll and you should get off if you want to play that game.

As far as the AI being able to raze when it chooses I like that as well even if it is a bug. Perhaps they may see it as a perk to the AI at higher levels? I could go for that.

 

He is reporting a bug, an obvious bug. Clown comes in and says not a bug because he's fine with it.

 

Yes its a bug, if you don't care whether or not it exists don't post in the thread. Calling someone a troll for keeping his thread on topic is asinine at the very least.

 

IMO it should take 1 turn to raze per level of the city, makes sense to very quickly burn down newly formed cities while taking much longer for established ones.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 6, 2013 6:22:06 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting abob101,

I don't get this thing where lately there's a few guys suggesting that reloading a game is somehow cheating...??  Who the heck are they cheating by reloading?  If someone wants to reload a game for whatever reason then that's their call... no-one is playing their game but them.  It's a rather derogatory term that I don't personally think is necessary.

Cheating in the Solitaire is still cheating

However, the temptation is strong and I admit that despite I am quite good at resisting it sometimes (very few times) I find excuses to convince myself is not cheating . I remember a Warhammer 40K PC game (I think it was called "Chaos Gate") that had a difficulty level called "Heroic" and was described like this "You can only have one slot used for that game, and any time that one of your units is killed the game gets saved automatically". I think that option would be cool to be implemented. 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 6, 2013 7:35:29 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting OliverFA_306,


Quoting abob101, reply 15
I don't get this thing where lately there's a few guys suggesting that reloading a game is somehow cheating...??  Who the heck are they cheating by reloading?  If someone wants to reload a game for whatever reason then that's their call... no-one is playing their game but them.  It's a rather derogatory term that I don't personally think is necessary.

Cheating in the Solitaire is still cheating

However, the temptation is strong and I admit that despite I am quite good at resisting it sometimes (very few times) I find excuses to convince myself is not cheating . I remember a Warhammer 40K PC game (I think it was called "Chaos Gate") that had a difficulty level called "Heroic" and was described like this "You can only have one slot used for that game, and any time that one of your units is killed the game gets saved automatically". I think that option would be cool to be implemented. 

 

Who is being cheated in solitaire, if the person playing changes the rules? Cheating implies one person (team, corporation) gaining an advantage over someone else. How can a person gain an advantage over themselves?

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 6, 2013 9:40:25 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums


Calling it "changing the rules" is another way of cheating yourself (and that answers the question )

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 6, 2013 10:00:47 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

The question I asked was who is getting an advantage when one changes the rules in a single player game? You didn't answer the question.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 6, 2013 10:05:00 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Needs to be fixed. I'd rather see cities blue to be razed immediately by all or have it take time to raze.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 6, 2013 10:34:00 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Needs to be fixed. I'd rather see cities blue to be razed immediately by all or have it take time to raze.

That's our man.   Look forward to seeing this fixed up soon (whatever is in elementaldefs.xml, same duration for all AI and players alike) 

(although not sure why we're only looking at the blue cities, surely all colors deserve the same approach).   

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 6, 2013 1:28:00 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting n0fo,



IMO it should take 1 turn to raze per level of the city, makes sense to very quickly burn down newly formed cities while taking much longer for established ones.

This is an interesting idea.

 

Another idea: When you choose to Raze, the raze happens dynamically to the equation 2xlvl = raze time limit where each turn that goes by reduces the population by current - current*currentlevel/2. (equation may be off). point is that the final turn should result in reducing the population to zero, thus concluding the complete destruction of the city.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
Stardock Forums v1.0.0.0    #108432  walnut2   Server Load Time: 00:00:00.0000484   Page Render Time: