Home | Recent Posts New Topic
BlueHawkSun
BlueHawkSun
Join Date 10/2012
0

[1.30] Unable to recast Tireless March

March 1, 2013 5:11:38 PM from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

I cast tireless march on one hero and several turns later decided that another hero could better utilize it. So I went to the enchantment menu and cancelled it on the first hero. That hero stack went back to movement 2. I tried that turn and again 3 turns later to cast tireless march but it remains greyed out and unavailable.

Locked Post
Search this post
Advanced Search
Subscription Options
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
2 Pages1 2 
BlueHawkSun
MuLaFlaga
Join Date 03/2006
+9
Reply #1 March 1, 2013 5:19:26 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

To my understanding as of 1.30 tireless march can only be cast once.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
The_Regicide
Join Date 02/2005
+22
Reply #2 March 1, 2013 8:44:53 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

I can confirm, can't recast it. Waiting for a hundred turns doesn't seem to help.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
kirkpp
Join Date 03/2003
0
Reply #3 March 1, 2013 8:52:24 PM
from Stardock ForumsStardock Forums

Seems like a bug to me. The change log said you can only cast one at a time, but looks like you can only cast once and that's forever.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
coyote303
Join Date 03/2008
+7
Reply #4 March 2, 2013 1:55:49 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Thanks for the heads up. I know now not to cancel my one and only Tireless March cast--at least until they fix this bug.

(I think the idea to only allow one Tireless March at a time is a good one. I hope they correct the implementation of it soon.)

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
willie sanderson
Join Date 05/2003
+6
Reply #5 March 2, 2013 7:58:31 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

I'm not sure it's a BUG and is therefore now WORKING AS DESIGNED because it's a very powerful overpowered spell that if one had the ability to cast it on all ones stacks one would easily drive and beat the AI on most ridiculous and insane levels even. No fix required.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
StevenAus22
Join Date 06/2010
+110
Reply #6 March 2, 2013 8:00:30 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

It might be good to allow only one unit to have the spell at a time, and then if you take it off you could put it onto another unit.  But even then it might be a bit OP.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
coyote303
Join Date 03/2008
+7
Reply #7 March 2, 2013 3:38:20 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

 

I'm not sure it's a BUG and is therefore now WORKING AS DESIGNED because it's a very powerful overpowered spell that if one had the ability to cast it on all ones stacks one would easily drive and beat the AI on most ridiculous and insane levels even. No fix required.

No, it is not working as intended. This is what the change log said:

"Tireless March can only be cast on one unit at a time"

This is a good change. However, what is happening is you can only cast it once and not again if you cancel it.

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
Necaradan666
Join Date 08/2006
+1
Reply #8 March 3, 2013 6:05:14 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

I'd also like to confirm that as of 1.32 if you force a sovereign under the effect of tireless march to surrender you'll lose the enchant on whichever unit you had it cast. Then you'll find no way to dispel the effect on the vassal sov. And you can only cast the spell once per game even after dismissing the bugged sov. 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
FuzzyGold
Join Date 10/2012
0
Reply #9 March 3, 2013 7:51:14 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

I have 2 vassal sovs that have Timeless March.

 

I don't buy the argument against stacking.  If I can do it so can the AI.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
GFireflyE
Join Date 05/2011
+63
Reply #10 March 4, 2013 10:15:05 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums


Agreed, while Tireless March only being cast once is a FANTASTIC change, the fact that you can't cancel and recast is a downer. Also, I've found that when I cast, I can't choose the unit to cast onto. It's always my sovereign. (procipanee). Suppose to be this way? 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
UncleJJ44
Join Date 10/2012
+2
Reply #11 March 4, 2013 10:44:15 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums


I agree that only one Tireless march should apply to a stack of units but think this is the wrong way to apply the change. 

It was overpowered when multple copies of the spell could apply as in previous versions of FE.  That made a stack of heroes extremely powerful, able to move many tiles (up to 13 tiles with 9 champions) through enemy territory in ways the AI could never deal with.  Or those extra moves could be used to complete 2 quests per turn (purchased from an Altar city) and level the stack of heroes at a ridiculous rate.

I think a better way to limit the way the spell works is to allow any champion to have the enchantment but to limit its effect to only one instance per stack of units.  So a stack with several champions all with Tireless march would still only gain +1 movement.

Only allowing one instance of the spell to be cast once in a game rather limits the usefulness of the spell.  It has gone from being overpowered to almost but not quite useless

JJ

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
paladinjb
Join Date 03/2010
+2
Reply #12 March 4, 2013 12:42:38 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

I think it is a good change as long as it the bug gets fixed.  Extra movement points in both tactical battles and on the world map is a powerful bonus.  Don't forget that even though the AI can use the spell, that the unaligned mobs are stuck at a base movement of 1 regardless of if they are a winged dragon or a slow earth elemental.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
streubie
Join Date 03/2013
0
Reply #13 March 4, 2013 12:55:34 PM
from Stardock ForumsStardock Forums

I noticed this bug(?) yesterday, as well as the enchantment that allows champs to cast heal. I put it on one one, seemingly couldn't use it on another, dispelled to chose a different target and it was permanently grayed out. I also have an enchantment that allows all champs to cast fireball, but haven't tested it. Wondering if this a larger bug that effects more of these types of abilities?

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
Publius of NV
Join Date 08/2002
+231
Reply #14 March 5, 2013 8:25:22 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting UncleJJ44,
reply 11
I think a better way to limit the way the spell works is to allow any champion to have the enchantment but to limit its effect to only one instance per stack of units. So a stack with several champions all with Tireless march would still only gain +1 movement.

Agreed.  I never even realized you could cast it on multiple champions in the same stack and get +1 for each.  IMHO it should be limited to +1 movement per stack.  Restricting it to only be cast on one champion is, IMHO, too restrictive, and only being able to cast it once even if dispelled seems to clearly be a bug.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
Alstein
Join Date 07/2004
+55
Reply #15 March 5, 2013 9:54:05 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Tireless march should be +1 movement for the unit, that's it, and maybe unmounted units only.

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
coyote303
Join Date 03/2008
+7
Reply #16 March 6, 2013 12:12:35 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting Alstein,
reply 15

Tireless march should be +1 movement for the unit, that's it, and maybe unmounted units only.

 

That's actually a good idea. It would give you more reason to create unmounted units late in the game by closing the gap in strategic speed.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
Mistwraithe
Join Date 05/2003
+20
Reply #17 March 6, 2013 4:51:35 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

I seriously wonder about Stardock's testing team at times. I mean how many things are there to test with a change that is described as "Tireless March can only be cast on one unit at a time"?

For example:

* If I have Tireless March cast on a unit already can I cast it again? (should be no)

* If I then cancel Tireless March on the unit then can I cast it again? (should be yes)

* If the unit with Tireless March on it dies then can I cast it again? (should be yes)

Etc.

Yet it appears they only tested the very first basic step.

Actually to be honest the developer who made the change should have tested all this before checking it in anyway, then the tester confirms everything is working before release.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
Furibar
Join Date 04/2003
0
Reply #18 March 6, 2013 6:32:30 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

What about casting a spell that would give the Tireless March bonus to a Sov/Champion, but that would also be limited in duration ?

It would allow you to recover some real strategic opportunities (blitzkrieg, long range scouting, recruiting raids) with a higher cost than before, when Tireless March was too much powerful. Spell duration being very limited, you would have to manage your buffs carefully.

That's the "spirit" of my recent attempt : Army Orders, at the Nexus. Details :

Motivation : Cast for 30 mana and 5 Influence - Unlocked with Ereog + Life II - Maintenance Cost = 1
Stimulation : Cast for 30 mana and 15 Gold - Unlocked with Ereog + Death II - Maintenance Cost = 1
Both of them have the following effect :
- Army gets +1 to movement (+1 for 5 life/death shards) during 15 turns

The spell can be stacked on the same army, if you can pay the cost (recast : 1 turn)

I've just started a big game with it (huge map, epic techs) but I'm not sure of the balance, any advice is welcome.

 

Btw, the Tireless March "new system" has been extended (by SD in FE v1.3x) to the spells giving the target the ability to cast Fireball and Heal (for what I've seen in the code).

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
mqpiffle
Join Date 10/2010
+44
Reply #19 March 7, 2013 1:39:16 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting Furibar,
reply 18
Btw, the Tireless March "new system" has been extended (by SD in FE v1.3x) to the spells giving the target the ability to cast Fireball and Heal (for what I've seen in the code).

Not exactly.  Only the sovereign can cast the spell.

I suspect they're using that unlock as a limiter somehow, but I can't really wrap my head around it.  I suspect it has some hard-coding involved.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
Furibar
Join Date 04/2003
0
Reply #20 March 7, 2013 5:29:29 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting mqpiffle,
reply 19
I suspect it has some hard-coding involved.

I would bet on it ! I've spent 2 hours on it before giving up, grumbling about hard-coding ...

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
willie sanderson
Join Date 05/2003
+6
Reply #21 March 7, 2013 6:26:20 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums


I like the idea of only being able to cast it ONCE per game. Makes a player THINK before using it. And that's what STRATEGIC games are about...THINKING.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
DerekPaxton
Join Date 03/2003
+309 sdemployee
Reply #22 March 7, 2013 11:56:49 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

This will be fixed in the 1.4 patch.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
The_Regicide
Join Date 02/2005
+22
Reply #23 March 8, 2013 6:39:42 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting willie sanderson,
reply 21


I like the idea of only being able to cast it ONCE per game. Makes a player THINK before using it. And that's what STRATEGIC games are about...THINKING.

Let's introduce a bug that makes Pioneers non-functional. Makes the player THINK before setting up his capitol. And that's what STRATEGIC games are aabout...THINKING.

 

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
GFireflyE
Join Date 05/2011
+63
Reply #24 March 8, 2013 11:22:27 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting Derek Paxton,
reply 22
This will be fixed in the 1.4 patch.

Thanks Derek.

/thread

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
BlueHawkSun
willie sanderson
Join Date 05/2003
+6
Reply #25 March 10, 2013 10:49:13 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting The_Regicide,
reply 23



Quoting willie sanderson,
reply 21
I like the idea of only being able to cast it ONCE per game. Makes a player THINK before using it. And that's what STRATEGIC games are about...THINKING.


Let's introduce a bug that makes Pioneers non-functional. Makes the player THINK before setting up his capitol. And that's what STRATEGIC games are aabout...THINKING.

 

 

I could go for that means you only get 1 city. That'll make you THINK where you settle. I win again.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
2 Pages1 2 
Stardock Forums v        Server Load Time:   Page Render Time: