Is Fallen Enchantress the best strategy game of modern times?

By on October 17, 2012 6:44:14 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Xan

Join Date 01/2003
+23

  So I've been playing the newest build. It's supposedly a beta. But feels finished to me. That's not what I want to write about.

  I discovered Stardock years ago from their WindowBlinds stuff. Then I got into Demigod which was a disappointment. Then I got into WOM and that was a bigger disappointment. I know people don't like me bringing that up but you just got to face it.  

  As a customer and a gamer, Stardock has 2 wins and 2 losses with me. I'm not a fanboy and I'm not a troll. I think I'm representative. I'm in my 30s. I don't have a lot of time for games. I am looking for a game that doesn't feel like it was just pooped out the mass market conveyor belt (I'm looking at you XCOM, CIV V).

  I didn't know that Civilization IV was going to be such an anomaly. I thought it was going to be the start of a new golden age for strategy gaming. But it's been down hill since then. Think about it. 

  Civilization IV came out n 2005. That was 7 years ago. To me, modern times means since I got my last computer which was in 2009 when Windows 7 came out. That was a long time ago in gaming standards. If you like strategy games, what are the choices?

  Disicples II, Civilization V, Sword of the Stars II, HOMM VI, Endless Space, Warlock, Total War: Shogun.

  Of those, I could only tolerate Endless Space and Shogun. I hope they make an Endless Space II. Shogun was fun for awhile.

   But none of them can even briefly be compared to the richness of EFE. Not because they aren't good games. It's because none of them have even tried to be ambitious. WOM was ambitious and collapsed under its own weight. At least it tried I guess. Civilization IV was ambitious and they stripped it down to make the mass market friendly Civilization V.

   So I ask, if not EFE, then what? What modern game even comes close to providing the sheer joy and depth and fun of EFE? You have to dig back. Way back to do so.

   I haven't got to play the campaign and I don't care about mods (sorry Kael). I don't care about those things. What I do know is that on a cold Fall friday night i can sit down and load up EFE and play it all weekend and not know what is in store. 

   For the first time since I got this computer, I say to you, bravo Stardock. You have delivered the goods. This is the best game I've played since I got this computer. Thank you.

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October 17, 2012 6:47:22 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

It's going to be tough for this game to surpass Civ IV BTS and all its mods.  

 

That said, it's come closer than any game since then, and there's still another expansion (hopefully).

 

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October 17, 2012 6:59:31 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

According to your definition of modern times: yes, without a doubt.

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October 17, 2012 7:10:25 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

 
Holy overhyped.It is a much better game than War of Magic and a good game in general  but will not set the world alight in my opinion.

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October 17, 2012 7:10:39 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

If you like strategy games, what are the choices?

Disicples II, Civilization V, Sword of the Stars II, HOMM VI, Endless Space, Warlock, Total War: Shogun.

 

There's a lot more than that.  I suggest you check out all the Paradox titles, such as the Hearts of Iron series, Europa Universalis III, and Crusader Kings II; the KOEI games, especially the Romance of the Three Kingdoms and Nobunaga's Ambition series; the many war strategy titles published by Shrapnel Games; and the excellent American Civil War game, Forge of Freedom.  And they're all essentially "modern times," if you mean sharing a raft of modern features, and access to plenty of memory in providing them.

 

There's much more than that around, but those are some of the highlights you missed.  I don't mean to be critical, but before raising such a question, it's probably a good idea to really investigate the field.

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October 17, 2012 7:12:29 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums


Without a doubt - only I hope elemental keeps goin like tha jaws movies #1 - 23?

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October 17, 2012 7:19:39 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

There's a lot more than that.  I suggest you check out all the Paradox titles, such as the Hearts of Iron series, Europa Universalis III, and Crusader Kings II; the KOEI games, especially the Romance of the Three Kingdoms and Nobunaga's Ambition series; the many war strategy titles published by Shrapnel Games; and the excellent American Civil War game, Forge of Freedom.  And they're all essentially "modern times," if you mean sharing a raft of modern features, and access to plenty of memory in providing them. 


There's much more than that around, but those are some of the highlights you missed.  I don't mean to be critical, but before raising such a question, it's probably a good idea to really investigate the field.[/quote]

Most of those games are very very old.  I played EU3 5 years ago. The last Romance of the Three Kingdoms game is over half a decade old.  I think you just have a different idea of modern time sthan I do.

I didn't miss them. I played them. A long. Long. Long. Time ago.

 

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October 17, 2012 7:22:06 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

"I don't always play computer games, but when I do, I prefer FE." - Lan

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October 17, 2012 7:22:57 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Ashbery76,
 

Holy overhyped.It is a much better game than War of Magic and a good game in general  but will not set the world alight in my opinion.

Compared to...what?

If I'm a PC gamer looking to play a good 4X game. What should I buy? 

Endless Space is a good game. I think I agree with XAN that I think its sequel might push it into FE's league.

Warlock? It's just a big tactical battle that was prettied to look like Civ V (big mistake).

M&M: Heroes VI? 

If you're willing to be hard core, there's Conquest of Elysium 3 but that's really hard core.

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October 17, 2012 7:29:04 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting AlLanMandragoran,
"I don't always play computer games, but when I do, I prefer FE." - Lan

yeah baby

 

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October 17, 2012 7:44:16 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I agree with OP. Only competition is Europa Universalis III. I believe I will get more enjoyment out of FE, especially after I create some mods.

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October 17, 2012 7:53:50 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I wish people would stop dumping on the new xcom. It's one of the best gaming experiences I've ever had and clearly looks to be a labor of love to me.

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October 17, 2012 8:43:56 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Xan,



There's a lot more than that.  I suggest you check out all the Paradox titles, such as the Hearts of Iron series, Europa Universalis III, and Crusader Kings II; the KOEI games, especially the Romance of the Three Kingdoms and Nobunaga's Ambition series; the many war strategy titles published by Shrapnel Games; and the excellent American Civil War game, Forge of Freedom.  And they're all essentially "modern times," if you mean sharing a raft of modern features, and access to plenty of memory in providing them. 


There's much more than that around, but those are some of the highlights you missed.  I don't mean to be critical, but before raising such a question, it's probably a good idea to really investigate the field.





Most of those games are very very old.  I played EU3 5 years ago. The last Romance of the Three Kingdoms game is over half a decade old.  I think you just have a different idea of modern time sthan I do.

I didn't miss them. I played them. A long. Long. Long. Time ago.

 [/quote]

 

Yet if you define "modern" as games that are only a year old, there are more than a dozen strategy games you missed that are published by Shrapnel Games, and other companies like it.  And that should also include Paradox's Crusader Kings II, East vs West, and Sengoku, all of which are roughly a year old or less.  If you meant to ask, "Is FE the best strategy game of the last year?" they all fit the conditions you set.  Unlike Disciples II, which you do include, and which came out ten years ago.

 

Though to be honest, I've never heard "modern" used in this fashion except by PR departments, who want us all to believe anything over a year old is old-fashioned and trash-worthy.  It's an attempt to introduce planned obsolescence to a field where games in the last decade aren't obsolete--so players must be conditioned to think they are.

 

Still, your choice.

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October 17, 2012 9:16:05 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Who is talking 1 year? 

 Yah, I think games that are over half a decade old don't qualify as modern games anymore. Modern to me means it won't look blatantly dated. 

 Crusader Kings II is a decent, modern  game but not on the level of EFE.

 IMHO you have to go back to Civilization IV BTS to get a game that's at EFE's level. That's a long time.

 

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October 17, 2012 9:24:18 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Glazunov1,


Yet if you define "modern" as games that are only a year old, there are more than a dozen strategy games you missed that are published by Shrapnel Games, and other companies like it.  And that should also include Paradox's Crusader Kings II, East vs West, and Sengoku, all of which are roughly a year old or less.  If you meant to ask, "Is FE the best strategy game of the last year?" they all fit the conditions you set.  Unlike Disciples II, which you do include, and which came out ten years ago.

Why are you assuming he's missing those games just because he didn't mention them? Other than CK2, the others you mentioned are pretty mediocre.  Sengoku? Really? 

I don't know how you define the "modern" area. To each their own. Is FE the best strategy game of 2012? Undoubtedly. Is it the best strategy game of all time? I think you'd have to put in some qualifications there. I think it's the best >fantasy< strategy game of all time including MOM. I think it's better than Civilization IV out of the box but not as good as Civilization IV eventually got with expansions. It's better than Galactic Civilizations II out of the box but not as good as Galactic Civilizations II TA. 

I wish there was more competition, frankly. FE is the best because no one else seems interested in making games with this kind of substance / production value balance anymore. Where is Soren Johnson when you need him?

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October 17, 2012 9:27:59 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I like the new XCOM. Not sure why that got dragged into here. It's not a strategy game in the sense that fallen enchantress is. Very different genres.

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October 17, 2012 9:38:24 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Best since Civ IV, yep, I'd agree there. With mods, may even surpass that.

Now that we are talking other strategy games, can someone tell me how we still don't have f'n SMAC2 yet?!

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October 17, 2012 9:46:51 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Not Yet.

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October 17, 2012 9:51:05 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Uh.  To answer the title.  Galactic Civilzations 2 (also by Stardock ).   Will FE unseat the champ ?  Hard to tell. 

But I predict an epidemic of one more turn syndrome

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October 17, 2012 10:00:55 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting TheJaker,
 Sengoku? Really? 
Well, no Sengoku, no CK2.  I saw Sengoku as a test bed (and maybe pre-funding) for CK2.  No, I don't play it anymore, but it was well priced for what you got.  I put Sengoku in the "Paradox Lite" category that Crown of the North and Two Thrones reside in. Just my two cents.

 

To the OP:

I agree Endless Space is pretty solid, and I love the ongoing support.  Not the deepest or most epic-feeling game, but it's solid and entertaining.

I don't know if you've played Disciples 3, but it's worth a spin.  The Disciple series keeps drawing me back if only for the atmosphere and artwork (hey, don't judge me; how many saps out there play Final Fantasy because "the cut scenes are awesome!").

Tropico 4, while not a 4x, is an entertaining strategy game (if you like being Castroito)

So yeah, I guess E:FE is gunning to be in a class of its own at this point.  I'm still waiting for SMAC2, MoO4, and AoW4...

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October 17, 2012 10:23:36 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting TheJaker,

Why are you assuming he's missing those games just because he didn't mention them?

 

Because he defined exactly the games he included:

 

If you like strategy games, what are the choices? Disicples II, Civilization V, Sword of the Stars II, HOMM VI, Endless Space, Warlock, Total War: Shogun.

 

Other than CK2, the others you mentioned are pretty mediocre.  Sengoku? Really?

 

I wasn't discussing the quality of the games (though I do disagree with your opinion; but each to their own).  I was questioning his remark about limiting the games to the last year or so, and defining just those games above as fitting within the timeframe he's defined.  There are many more; plus, he's including one game that's ten years old.  That's all.


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October 17, 2012 10:37:19 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Not going to play mods eh? Too bad because that is where FE has the most depth. It's like ordering a steak at a nice restaurant and only eating the salad. 

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October 17, 2012 11:01:33 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I am surprised that no one mentioned the Age of Wonders series yet; they are TBS games in the tradition of Master of Magic, just like FE is. The newest game, AoW II Shadow Magic (from 2002!), is still superior to FE is many aspects, most notably user interface, magic, and tactical battles.

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October 17, 2012 11:23:49 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I think it's silly to get into an argument over the semantics of "modern".  If you want to have a discussion, discuss what is important: features and qualities.  Quibbling over the definition of a word that is at best secondary to the argument is, as was shown, a waste of time.

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October 17, 2012 11:37:55 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting DrThrash,
I am surprised that no one mentioned the Age of Wonders series yet; they are TBS games in the tradition of Master of Magic, just like FE is. The newest game, AoW II Shadow Magic (from 2002!), is still superior to FE is many aspects, most notably user interface, magic, and tactical battles.

 

I agree. It seemed much more put together,

 

I expect FE to be my 5th favorite fantasy TBS behind MOM, AOW:SM, Dominions 3 and HOMM3. 

I expect it will be my 2nd favorite TBS to mod behind Dominions 3.

 

Hopefully, it will exceed my expectations

 

 

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October 18, 2012 12:08:11 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting jshores,

I expect it will be my 2nd favorite TBS to mod behind Dominions 3.

 

Check out Crusader Kings II--a very unusual TBS, in which combat, though important, is considerably less so than managing diplomatic relations with the dukes, counts, barons, bishops, and mayors of your nation.  And King of Dragon Pass, an unusual game that's a mix of TBS sim and RPG.  I can almost guarantee you it will be nothing else you've ever played, whether you like it or not.

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