AI Wars: Beta 3 Edition

By on April 24, 2012 6:38:44 PM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

Draginol

Join Date 03/2001
+102

Update: 

Hour long AI test video for the truly die hards who want to see all the mistakes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnPKHQIksrA&feature=youtu.be

 

I see all. I know all. At least, when it comes to this map.

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In the top left we have Markin, leader of the AI civilization of Gilden.

In the bottom right, we have me, Draginol, leader of Pariden.

How many turns will it take me to wipe them out? What mistakes will the AI make that can be exploited (and fixed)?

First…some notes

This build is 0.911 which has some balance updates to make sovereigns and champions a little less powerful. The monsters are somewhat more aggressive and the AI has had some general improvements since 0.91.

Second…help me!

If you see me making a mistake, let me know.

Early Game:

I train up two pioneers and then the tower of dominion. I recruit a champion and send the champion in one direction and my sovereign in another.

(to be continued).

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Othollo vs. Black Widow monster. Othollo has stone skin enchantment on him already.

Othollo wins.

Opinion: Level 1 champion shouldn’t be able to take out a black widow. Suggestion, Stone skin should do +4 defense plus +4 per earth shard.

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Same issue:

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My first level sovereign took out a troll by himself.

Opinion: Troll should get 2X more HP than it currently does.

AI Early game: Meanwhile…

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Lord Markin just did the same thing. However, he isn’t using stone skin.

Opinion: Stone skin should be a “gotta have” for the sovereign.

Let’s look at the code…

Ok, this is where “strategy” comes into play in AI writing.  The code is very conservative about casting spells with regards to mana.  So at the start of the game, it doesn’t cast a lot of spells even though, IMO, it should cast some spells as early as possible even if it means lowering the available mana.

There are a few ways to do this:

1. Have an XML value for “Early Game AI multiplier” which tells the game to multiply the value early on.

2. Have the code take into account that the value of storing mana should be different at different times in the game.

3. Treat certain unit targets different than others (the value of a spell that affects a sovereign is different than a spell that might target a champion that is stationed in a city).

etc.

AIs in the mist

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As you can see, the AI is intent on building a civilization. An admirable goal to be sure.  But not a good strategy.

By contrast…

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My early development has focused on training up pioneers and now soldiers to go out and conquer.

With those units, I go out and level up:

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By contrast, the AI leader is Soloing it:

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Mind you, it’s not that I don’t think about sending units to reinforce the sovereign.  It’s always a balance between how far should it send them and how long should the sovereign wait around? What’s the attrition rate of units getting to the sovereign? Should I send the sovereign home or keep him in the field?

There’s a lot of tweaking that goes into this sort of thing that improves iteration by iteration.

Combining Heroes

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One thing the AI does is that once champions get to a certain level, it will gradually put 2 in an army and potentially 3 or more depending on their level.

This is something I have to tweak almost every build because what is a “high enough” level changes.

Now, In this battle the AI is escorting pioneers with two champions and a Drolgard (a mid level Gildenian unit).

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The AI (bpttp, left) casts stone skin on himself and then gift of iron right off the bat.

Gilden’s Drolgard unit is better than my Destiny’s Guard unit but he only has 1 of them (the other is a scout). But he does have two champions.

Let’s see what he’s done with his champions:

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Yeesh. Level 12.  This is why I get nervous about changing the soloing behavior. Because there is a cost to having the AI wait around for escorts even if he does get killed a lot more often.  If sovereigns got injuries, I’d have to rewrite this.

His other hcampion isn’t that great.

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vs.

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It’s going to really boil down to whether I can take out his units and his extra champion I think.

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On the second round, the AI Markin cast growth on himself. Then his champion cast haste on him. So this is not looking very promising.

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The growth spell AI Markin has is self explanatory. And bad for me.

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So if I should have done something differently there, feel free to tell me.

 

…later, Lord Markin is alone. How powerful is he?

 

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This is a bit of an ambush but let’s see what I can do against him.

His first turn he casts growth.

His second turn he casts stone skin.

His third turn he casts gift of iron. Very wasteful. Will check his mana after the battle. But it’s pretty bloody nasty combo. He has a 63 defense.

Here is how the rest of the battle goes:

http://screencast.com/t/uuG8UvkqKO

He only has 65 mana left so he must have determined that he needed to win that battle.

So that’s enough for today.  Plenty to integrate in for this week.

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April 24, 2012 12:09:40 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I usually start with a scout, then tower of dominion, then pioneer. Starting with two pioneers is a waste to me, because you can't really use any world resource, and if you build another city right away your growth will be very low.

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April 24, 2012 12:20:18 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Why make champions and sovereign less powerful ??? NOOOOOOOOOO

I think they could be more powerful on the other hand ! They cast monstruous spells that's normal that they're powerful !

I still find them pretty weak, especially the champions compared to the world's creatures.

Spells could be more damaging too both for your army and for the enemy at a point that you pay more attention to spells when they're cast instead ofthinking bah it's oKay if I let it pass...

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April 24, 2012 12:20:51 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Second…help me!

Based on your comments above I believe you are most definitely headed in the right direction!

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April 24, 2012 12:44:37 PM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

My opinion is that champions and sovereigns should BECOME titans of power. But they should start out pretty ordinary.

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April 24, 2012 12:54:56 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Opinion: Level 1 champion shouldn’t be able to take out a black widow. Suggestion, Stone skin should do +4 defense plus +4 per earth shard.

 Or make the monsters really powerful, instead? The main issue, as I see it is that monsters are laughably weak. 6 armor + 3 per shard looks fine to me, a giant spider that has as much attack as a peasant with a mace (less, actually) and a low number of HP is the real problem.
 
My opinion is that champions and sovereigns should BECOME titans of power.
They don't - unless they go on the path of the mage with 3 evokers traits, in which case they become living gods.
 
Currently, heroes are strong peasants with artifacts (Sword of the Sun and the Moon, Doom Club, etc.), not Titans of power. Conan isn't strong because he loots artifacts, Conan is strong because he can behead a demon with a rusty sword.
 
Melee heroes that do not loot an artifact from a unique monster are weak, because the traits are weak (well, actually, they can be weak and invulnerable thanks to the unbalanced amounts of armor one can have currently). +1/+2/+3 attack or +1/+2 initiative doesn't make a hero compete with 7 guys with battleaxes. 
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April 24, 2012 1:05:38 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

The issue isn't how powerful the Hero is, but where the power comes from. Heroic weapons and armor found in loot are so incredibly OPed that nothing else can really compete. Traits IMO should be where the Hero's power comes from. A hero with a spear should be as good as 5 men with a spear because he is an expert at parrying blows and attacking weak points in armor. I don't like that a hero simply finds a spear that does 5 times the attack of a normal spear and then has to fight with a crappy one for 10 battles until he learns enough to be able to use it. An epic spear should only do slightly more damage than a normal one, be lighter, have an Accuracy bonus, and do one special thing that changes he unit's tactics in some way. The rest of the power should come from special abilities.

 

Currently the best strategy is to ignore all buildings in favor of spearman on turn one. get 4 of them and your Sov. Go kill stuff and keep making more. Never build Tower of Dom, never have taxes, never lose. The prestige from leveling the Sov will level your city 6 times faster than Tower of Dominion and the Unrest bonus is negligible compared to the power of a spearman. Once in a while get a pioneer out there to plop down a settlement. Rinse, repeat, conquer the world.

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April 24, 2012 1:10:20 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I usully play medium maps with 8 players, and the AI expands so fast you have to rush pioneers off the start. Your start seems pretty good, I usaully get a workshop second because it allows me to build other stuff faster but maybe that's just me.

I'm glad you see the same balance problems that I do with monsters. Any champion can kill the beginning monsters himself and thus level high enough to kill medium monsters by himself and onward until they can destroy empires by themselves. Pretty much every monster but super high level ones like dragons and elemental lords can be soloed by a champion and exist simply for feed. Monsters aren't a threat to one unit by itself let alone cities.

Quoting seanw3,
Currently the best strategy is to ignore all buildings in favor of spearman on turn one. get 4 of them and your Sov. Go kill stuff and keep making more. Never build Tower of Dom, never have taxes, never lose. The prestige from leveling the Sov will level your city 6 times faster than Tower of Dominion and the Unrest bonus is negligible compared to the power of a spearman. Once in a while get a pioneer out there to plop down a settlement. Rinse, repeat, conquer the world.

What are you fighting that your Sov can't handle himself so you need spearmen?

 

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April 24, 2012 1:41:09 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Werewindlefr,
Or make the monsters really powerful, instead? The main issue, as I see it is that monsters are laughably weak. 6 armor + 3 per shard looks fine to me, a giant spider that has as much attack as a peasant with a mace (less, actually) and a low number of HP is the real problem.
 
They don't - unless they go on the path of the mage with 3 evokers traits, in which case they become living gods.
 
Melee heroes that do not loot an artifact from a unique monster are weak, because the traits are weak (well, actually, they can be weak and invulnerable thanks to the unbalanced amounts of armor one can have currently). +1/+2/+3 attack or +1/+2 initiative doesn't make a hero compete with 7 guys with battleaxes. 

Yeah, your stoneskin suggestion is great, because it gets not overpowered with many shards and is useful at the start of the game.

I think melee heroes are as powerful as mage heroes if they have a high level (15+), because with the current scaling they hit every low level target, are immune to spells from low level casters, are immune (assassin) to attacks from low level fighters and are immune to the damage of low level fighters (warrior with heavy armor).

That would be no problem if the player and the AI level at the same speed, but with traits like brilliance and the right enemy selection the player can level much faster.

Quoting seanw3,
The issue isn't how powerful the Hero is, but where the power comes from. Heroic weapons and armor found in loot are so incredibly OPed that nothing else can really compete. Traits IMO should be where the Hero's power comes from. A hero with a spear should be as good as 5 men with a spear because he is an expert at parrying blows and attacking weak points in armor. I don't like that a hero simply finds a spear that does 5 times the attack of a normal spear and then has to fight with a crappy one for 10 battles until he learns enough to be able to use it. An epic spear should only do slightly more damage than a normal one, be lighter, have an Accuracy bonus, and do one special thing that changes he unit's tactics in some way. The rest of the power should come from special abilities.

Exactly, powerful items should require killing difficult monsters.

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April 24, 2012 2:37:55 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Frogboy,
My opinion is that champions and sovereigns should BECOME titans of power. But they should start out pretty ordinary.

I really like the idea of the Sovereigns becoming a titan.  I am less on board with the champions becoming so.  However, as I stated on the other thread, if they are going to become titans then there should be far less of them.  Walking around with a stack of 10 heroes that are Titans, will deplete how important they are.  The game will become a race of recruiting champions just to get the larger stack.  If your attacked by a strong army you should have a feeling anxiety.  If there is a champion leading the army it should be dread.  If the sovereign is there leading the army, it should be utter doom.  Right now, because there are so many champions in the game, it is kind of ho-hum.  Their fun, and the game is fun, but champions feel common just because of the quantity of them.

Speaking about the "other" thread, it should be a major decision to send a champion, particularly your sovereign into battle.  You need to do it, but damn it is going to suck if they die.  Make the consequences of losing a battle with one even worse.  Champion lost a arm, can no longer use two handed weapons or a weapon and a shield.  Champion was defeated in battle, suffered tremendous injuries, loses half of all acquired traits at random (champion can't remember is own name let alone how to do stuff).  The game I am playing I have 5 cities with two champions guarding four of five, plus I still have an army with three champions in it.  Champion suffers broken back, champion cannot be used for 30 turns and then carry capacity cut by two thirds.  Make the punishments hurt.

If they are going to become that powerful, than the punishment for using them foolishly should be equally as powerful.  Make it so if they lose once it would probably be better to just retire them.  Same goes for the sovereign.

 

Just my opinion.

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April 24, 2012 2:47:45 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting seanw3,
The issue isn't how powerful the Hero is, but where the power comes from. Heroic weapons and armor found in loot are so incredibly OPed that nothing else can really compete. Traits IMO should be where the Hero's power comes from. A hero with a spear should be as good as 5 men with a spear because he is an expert at parrying blows and attacking weak points in armor. I don't like that a hero simply finds a spear that does 5 times the attack of a normal spear and then has to fight with a crappy one for 10 battles until he learns enough to be able to use it. An epic spear should only do slightly more damage than a normal one, be lighter, have an Accuracy bonus, and do one special thing that changes he unit's tactics in some way. The rest of the power should come from special abilities.

Agreed. Damage should largely depend on weapon type. An arrow is an arrow and a spear is a spear. I hate to sound like one of those "realism" people, but this is important. The problem is one of quality of damage vs. volume of damage. The game makes no distinction between 1 catapult shot and and three swing of a champions sword. Sure they can both be deadly, but one can just about killa ton of people, while the other can kill only a couple (and just kills them really well). Spearmen should be much more efficient at killing other infantry and weak monsters than heroes are, but heroes should be the best choice for taking on those tough enemies like dragons. But the game currently has no way of reflecting this stuff because everything is just rolled into one big "Attack" value. Heroes should also gain an advantage by having better accuracy, but the other side of this problem is that to-hit is under implemented, because (quite rightly) they realised that battles in which half of attacks missed would be lame.

Most other games (like D&D and warhammer) don't just increase the power of the hero's attack indefinately: they give him multiple attack dice and add the resultant damages together (as is currently done for units, with 3 guys firing three arrows quite logically equating to 3 dice). If Elemental gave heroes multiple attack dice as they gained levels (say, from 2 to 5) then we wouldn't need to increase their attack (damage) values to such extremes to make them competetive with units. Heroes would still have marginally higher damage than units, but less attack dice, so they'd have a lower quantity of damage but higher quality. More importantly, giving every unit multiple attack dice would mean that accuracy could be implemented properly, because instead of rolling to hit for the whole attack, you could roll to hit for each dice individually and add them together, so even when one or two missed, you'd still do some damage.

It's not actually that big a change. I wrote a more detailed post on it here.

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April 24, 2012 3:06:54 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I certainly agree with the steps you are taking in this quick update and the way you are looking at the basics of one particular aspect. I've posted in the beta 3 my comments:

http://forums.elementalgame.com/422922/page/10/#3137496

I do agree on the overpowered item drops (heartseeker gained on level 3!) entioned above though...

 

great start

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April 24, 2012 3:29:23 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I would like to comment on Stoneskin.  I just hope its not cookie cutter-ish and wish the sovs had other things to use or try than that.  Cause if it its not SS (Stone Skin) there's an armor enhancing spell thats been used and abused to the gazillionth time.

Other thing is that Burning Hand doesn't seem to provide as much attack as SS does for defense.  

 

But I do agree with you on the Hit Points,  I'd like to see higher hps.  Perhaps also as a function of difficulty also.  When burning hands does 7 damage and your mace guys go wha-POW and mow down a mob with 91 damage.  I think why did I even bother with path of the mage?

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April 24, 2012 3:47:54 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Frogboy,
My opinion is that champions and sovereigns should BECOME titans of power. But they should start out pretty ordinary.

 

This is where I come from.

 

I play Pariden a lot at this point--almost exclusively.  I pursue an aggressive policy of pioneer production, because my sovereigns are out to grab every shard they can find.  It's admittedly a tradeoff: spell power (outposts) for research/food growth (cities), but that's all to the good.  As you mention, Brad, it's about meaningful choices.

 

I play conservatively in a combat sense, putting my sovereign, first acquired champion, and a summoned shadow warg in a single party.  That way I can usually clear a path, except when I'm granted an unlucky terrain of a valley with two relatively dangerous monsters nearby.  I look for all the champions I can find, since I know it's a race to grab them, as well.  In large games I like to see them in a reasonable quantity.  I always assume my opponents are doing about as well, and never worse.

 

Stoneskin is a useful spell in the early part of the game.  I wouldn't nerf it, but I would agree that opponents like a troll should have more hit points.  This also adds some tension to combat, as the troll could win by a lucky shot, while the hero could win by dint of regular accuracy and spell defense.

 

 

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April 24, 2012 4:02:54 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting ,
Lord Markin just did the same thing. However, he isn’t using stone skin.
Opinion: Stone skin should be a “gotta have” for the sovereign.
Let’s look at the code…
Ok, this is where “strategy” comes into play in AI writing.  The code is very conservative about casting spells with regards to mana.  So at the start of the game, it doesn’t cast a lot of spells even though, IMO, it should cast some spells as early as possible even if it means lowering the available mana.
There are a few ways to do this:
1. Have an XML value for “Early Game AI multiplier” which tells the game to multiply the value early on.
2. Have the code take into account that the value of storing mana should be different at different times in the game.
3. Treat certain unit targets different than others (the value of a spell that affects a sovereign is different than a spell that might target a champion that is stationed in a city).
etc.

I think the AI should scale mana use Dependant on how many forces it haves on the overall map, and try using more spells to win losing battles.
So if the AI is close to losing and have few forces left, it will burn through its mana reserves (at this point mostly in tactical combat and unit enchants) to win as many combats and kill as many enemies as possible.

Sincerely
~ Kongdej

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April 24, 2012 4:14:41 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Ok, this is where “strategy” comes into play in AI writing. The code is very conservative about casting spells with regards to mana. So at the start of the game, it doesn’t cast a lot of spells even though, IMO, it should cast some spells as early as possible even if it means lowering the available mana.

There are a few ways to do this:

How about comparing stored mana to the cost of your best spell, and perhaps multiplied by the total spell ranks of your champions?  Early on your best spell would be farily low cost, therefore less need for stored mana, and your champions would have less spell ranks.  Later, your spells are more costly and you have more champions drawing on your mana pool with higher casting abilities.  The mana pool should have an established optimum level at any given time.  More mana than that and you can cast your heart out.  Less, and you should be more conservative and prioritise claiming nodes, or even cancel some enchantments.

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April 24, 2012 4:23:22 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

It looks like you are observing what I am observing.  Monster hp should be up a bit.  I don't think my brand-new sovereign should be able to take on 2-3 bandits solo.

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April 24, 2012 4:39:29 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I don't know what changes were made to that build, but what I generally do is:

Start with sov until I find a champ, recruit him and then gather as many goody huts as possible while killing monsters. I have a question here: I usually go in a single group with the premise that the exp per monster is the same regardless of whether I'm alone or not. But going in group, I think, has the advantage of not losing any potential experience and, at the same time, being able to face stronger monsters. Is that correct? Anyway, once the level ups start coming, If available, I choose the +exp ones over the rest, to make the xp gain as efficient as possible.

In the meantime, while my sov and hero/s are busy roaming around and gathering stuff, completing quests and killing monsters, I'm usually building growth and production infrastructure. And researching anything to take advantage of the resources nearby ASAP (mining, channeling, etc.).

After that I pop out pioneers and start making outposts and cities. My sov/hero stack is usually already strong enough to face stronger monsters or some AI.

As for enchants, yes, I think they are very important to have the AI use them. I try to enchant all my units with everything possible, but if I'm afraid I'll be short on mana, I then prioritize protective enchantments to a designated tank (usually my sov!) leaving the rest unbuffed. The AI likes to attack their closest target.

Oh, and I DEFINITELLY agree on making the powerful artifacts (but also powerful units) come from difficult monsters/quests.

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April 24, 2012 5:11:19 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Werewindlefr,

Opinion: Level 1 champion shouldn’t be able to take out a black widow. Suggestion, Stone skin should do +4 defense plus +4 per earth shard.

 Or make the monsters really powerful, instead? The main issue, as I see it is that monsters are laughably weak. 6 armor + 3 per shard looks fine to me, a giant spider that has as much attack as a peasant with a mace (less, actually) and a low number of HP is the real problem.
 
My opinion is that champions and sovereigns should BECOME titans of power.
They don't - unless they go on the path of the mage with 3 evokers traits, in which case they become living gods.
 
Currently, heroes are strong peasants with artifacts (Sword of the Sun and the Moon, Doom Club, etc.), not Titans of power. Conan isn't strong because he loots artifacts, Conan is strong because he can behead a demon with a rusty sword.
 
Melee heroes that do not loot an artifact from a unique monster are weak, because the traits are weak (well, actually, they can be weak and invulnerable thanks to the unbalanced amounts of armor one can have currently). +1/+2/+3 attack or +1/+2 initiative doesn't make a hero compete with 7 guys with battleaxes. 

 

Suggestion:


New concept: prestige classes.  Require lvl 8 and a path skill.

 

Have classes like swordsmaster, barbarian, mediator, ranger- attached to the various paths.  These paths should give the real bonuses. 

Defender/Warrior/Assassin need to be buffed, Governor should use non-combat buffs (Krax's diplomat ability should be in path of the governor by default possibly), Mage doesn't really need nerfing except for evoker.

 

Evoker needs to be nerfed hard.  Dirge of Ceresa+ Evoker III= Ceresa can nuke anything in the game one-shot that isn't a dragon-class monster.

 

As for the magic items, maybe they should be just a tiny bit better then regular items, but give a + something per level?

 

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April 24, 2012 5:37:17 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Maybe the AI should be taking unit counts into account when deciding on spells?

Few units on own side -> use buffs and summons.

Many units on own side, few on enemy side -> debuffs and direct damage.

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April 24, 2012 5:41:53 PM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

Maybe the AI should be taking unit counts into account when deciding on spells?

Few units on own side -> use buffs and summons.

Many units on own side, few on enemy side -> debuffs and direct damage.

Already does.

As well as determining the value of each unit and how easy to kill those units would be through other means versus how much extra mana they have and how much mana they are producing per turn (to determine how wasteful they can be).

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April 24, 2012 5:43:29 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Alstein,

Suggestion:


New concept: prestige classes.  Require lvl 8 and a path skill.
 

 

It's interesting, and I'd love to see that in a mod.  But Stardock's in late beta, tweaking existing things out.

 

3. Treat certain unit targets different than others (the value of a spell that affects a sovereign is different than a spell that might target a champion that is stationed in a city).

 

I think this approach might work best, in that it finesses by degree better than, say, an early game AI multiplier, or an instruction based on point in the game. 

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April 24, 2012 6:00:55 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

On the stoneskin thing: I'd like to think (and actually suspect) that there is more of a holistic strategy to game balance than this, and that decisions aren't made simply on these kind of anecdotal experiences.

But more than this: we all broadly agree that spells should get more powerful as you get more shards and your caster improves his abilities. We also agree that we don't want to have spells that are simply "greater fireball," because it seems like lazy duplication. But these principles actually clash, because the mana cost of this powerful, scaled spell is still the same as it was when it was it was weak, while the mana cost of your new spells are high. Or to put it another way, why would i cast my new, shiny Touch of Entropy for a tonne of magicka, when Flame Dart does comparable damage for much less? Or, to use a more relevant example, is it fair that a master earth mage with a ton of shards can cast stoneskin and have a godlike defence in the late game, whilst still only paying 1 mana maint for the privelege?

What's more, it's not clear from the descriptions which spells are scaled by the caster's spell power, and in what way. This is very "under the hood," and not how stardock usually designs it's mechanics.

D&D does this quite well in my opinion. It has scaling, but it is of a limited nature. There are still higher level spells that are much better generally (and scale themselves).

So basically, what I'm saying is, the game needs to be consistent in how shards and spell power increase the efffects of spells. It needs to effect slow spells as much as fireballs. But more importantly, it needs to clearly explain how it is doing so. And though I like scaling, I also think the game would be better and easier to balance if spells scaled less (like, max double or triple of basic power) and there was a "greater fireball" for the late game. Shards shouldn't allow you to own a dragon with a flame dart (though they should keep them effective): they should allow you to cast epic magic like curgen's inferno etc.

The current fireball spell is a great (bad) example of this: it does comparable damage to a flame dart given the same shards and spell power (maybe slightly less i think?), but effects a larger area. But it costs much more mana. And it has a longer casting time and could effect my allies (making it tactically much more cumbersome). So once i looked at it I realised it was almost always better to cast a couple of flame darts. Sure, you've decided that since fireball is a bigger and more impressive spell it should have a longer casting time and higher mana costs, and that's fine. But if this game was being designed by the D&D guys they would have (and did, to the fireball spell in their own game) give it higher damage than the lower level spells.

Hope this doesn't sound to ranty or bossy, I just suspect it hasn't been thought about in this way.

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April 24, 2012 6:05:48 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Opinion: Level 1 champion shouldn’t be able to take out a black widow. Suggestion, Stone skin should do +4 defense plus +4 per earth shard.

I'd suggest to instead increase the downside of Stone Skin. Make it reduce Initiative by -2. Or increase the maintenance cost to 2/season.

 

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April 24, 2012 6:21:53 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Glazunov1,


It's interesting, and I'd love to see that in a mod.  But Stardock's in late beta, tweaking existing things out.
 

I'm curious.  What do you mean by this?

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April 24, 2012 6:26:53 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Is the spell-decision system based on XML values, or does the AI actually try the spells out to see how much of an effect they have? Maybe it could just try to see how much damage the spell does on average, or how much it changes stats etc if it doesn't do that already... XML-value based AI feels like artificial-non-intelligence to me...

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