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LordTheRon
LordTheRon
Join Date 03/2003
+13

[0.85] Difference in strategic and tactical summoning

February 24, 2012 5:30:46 AM from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

This is probably by design, but I would like to know why. When summoning creatures on the strategic map they are here to stay, which is great. But when I summon a creature on the tactical map during a battle, after the fight is over, my summoned creature is gone. Me no like!

This was true in version 0.77 and I have a feeling it's a design decision, but not one I fully understand since the casting cost is the same.

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LordTheRon
Das123
Join Date 05/2003
+82
Reply #1 February 24, 2012 7:57:41 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

I thought this was a bug. I actually stopped summoning creatures in tactical because it seemed wrong.

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LordTheRon
Lord Reliant
Join Date 03/2006
+39
Reply #2 February 24, 2012 8:11:43 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

I posted about this same issue here https://forums.elementalgame.com/417645

I hadn't had time to test if this was still the case, but sounds like it. I don't have an issue with tactical and strategic summons working differently, but I do have an issue with them costing the same amount of mana. Since tactical's only temporary for that battle, why not make it cheaper than a permanent summon?

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LordTheRon
ddd888
Join Date 04/2009
+7
Reply #3 February 24, 2012 8:23:57 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

its always been lik that in every game since 20 years?

 

also strategic creatures should have some sort of upkeep

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LordTheRon
phazonfreak
Join Date 08/2010
+31
Reply #4 February 24, 2012 9:50:52 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting ddd888,
reply 3
also strategic creatures should have some sort of upkeep

They have, see below:

The system is basically the same as in Master of Magic. I think it is perfectly reasonable as it is, maybe some balancing needed in the general mana numbers here and there, but the system itself is fine.

First of all, you have a difference in cost for both types of summons, since you have to pay a mana upkeep each turn to keep the creature on the strategic map. Apart from that, summoning a creature in tactical combat is a big advantage and therefore should cost the same amount of mana minus the upkeep, because you can go over the max unit limit in a stack which you cannot on the strategic map.

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LordTheRon
legaceez
Join Date 09/2006
0
Reply #5 February 24, 2012 10:33:25 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

this is to be expected and i think how every strategy game i played so far handles it. there are advantages to being able to summon during battle. if you are caught unprepared at least you have the option to summon help. yes it should cost the same in my opionion. the trade off is you have to maintenance on it after the fight.

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LordTheRon
seanw3
Join Date 12/2007
+141
Reply #6 February 24, 2012 10:50:53 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Don't forget that you can get more than 9 units on the field this way. 

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LordTheRon
Tasunke
Join Date 10/2009
+45
Reply #7 February 24, 2012 11:23:41 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Yea ... tactical summons are boss because you can exeed maximum number of units

While Strategic summons cost mana to upkeep.

 

Ultimately, if you have to use a summon in EVERY battle, its better to summon it strategically and bring it with you. If you only need summons in a pinch however (and have spare mana), best to wait until tactical to summon them.

 

(I like the difference)

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LordTheRon
LordTheRon
Join Date 03/2003
+13
Reply #8 February 24, 2012 3:13:00 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Ok, never realized strategic summons cost mana to upkeep. That's enough for me to warrant the difference and of course getting the extra unit on the field is pretty big too. Thanks for clarifying and no need to change it then.

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LordTheRon
Sarudak
Join Date 12/2006
+23
Reply #9 February 24, 2012 3:19:54 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Is anyone else finding the shadow warg summon to be crazy awesome?

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LordTheRon
LordTheRon
Join Date 03/2003
+13
Reply #10 February 24, 2012 4:30:29 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting Sarudak,
reply 9
Is anyone else finding the shadow warg summon to be crazy awesome?

It's nice, but Procipinee really needs it to survive the early stages. After a little while the summon does become less awesome, but still helpful.

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LordTheRon
Beric01
Join Date 01/2009
+10
Reply #11 February 24, 2012 5:37:08 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

If anything, tactical summoning is too cheap. If I only use a 20 mana summon spell every 20 rounds or less, it's actually cheaper for me to summon when needed, rather than maintain.

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LordTheRon
Tasunke
Join Date 10/2009
+45
Reply #12 February 24, 2012 6:03:04 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

it should always be a choice. Strategic and Tactical versions should cost the same period, imho. Just depends on if A) you want a levelled summon, and B ) how many fights you get into how often

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LordTheRon
Stupidity10
Join Date 09/2010
+4
Reply #13 February 25, 2012 7:44:47 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting Sarudak,
reply 9
Is anyone else finding the shadow warg summon to be crazy awesome?

It's way too powerful, Shadow wargs are tougher than skales/black widows/young ogres

While I Love the summoner trait they are too good for an initial summon

 

Shadow Warg OP

Earth Elemental OP

Fire Elemental UP

Ice Elemental Up

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LordTheRon
bpalczewski
Join Date 05/2010
+8
Reply #14 February 25, 2012 8:33:53 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting Beric01,
reply 11
If anything, tactical summoning is too cheap. If I only use a 20 mana summon spell every 20 rounds or less, it's actually cheaper for me to summon when needed, rather than maintain.

 

One thing to remember: summon on the world map can level up

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LordTheRon
TorinReborn
Join Date 10/2010
+5
Reply #15 February 25, 2012 8:41:48 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

There is another deal here. Summoning on strategy map you can only have one summon of each type and these summons are better the most early units that you need to build and cost a lot of money. Then during combat you can summon one more of each giving you access to 2x types of summons and that is enough to kills anything. Not to mention losing summons only costs you some mana and no build time.

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