This will be a long post, but I believe it is a necessary post. Firstly...I have been playing TBS-style games since I was old enough to read. Games like 4x are a dime a dozen, as in most do not provide any revolutionary new ideas, just different themes/settings.

FE *is* shaping up to be a good game. It is not, however shaping up to be a *great* or *epic* game. Personally, I could never settle for good if I was in the business. There may be a few additions to the system, some rebalances, a few tweaks...and that will make the game more stable and for some, more enjoyable. I could see myself playing for a while. Until something newer and shinier came along. 

It is my sincerest wish that this does not happen. This is the first beta I have participated in, and I will do all in my power to assist with a successful conclusion...but I do not think it to be fair to yourselves, or the players depending on the success of this game to settle for 'good enough'. I would like to, in the conclusion of all this, call up my brother and yap on excitedly to him about how great the game is and push/shove him into buying it for himself. As well as all my other friends. Currently...it does not have this effect on me. With how big this beta team is, you need to have a lot of good word of mouth from friend to friend to bump up sales when the game does finally release.

As to methods on how to do to this...to make FE an EPIC and more importantly, MEMORABLE game, there are lots. Some better then others. I will not try to claim my ideas are better, though they do make me happy, I'm sure they're not for everyone. Firstly, I will link to some of my posts  that contain some of my ideas that seem to have flown under the radar as...no one has bothered to reply to them.

https://forums.elementalgame.com/416937

https://forums.elementalgame.com/416814

(I'm sure I've got other lists of ideas scattered about on other peoples' threads since I can't seem to get anyone to read mine...even then they're mostly ignored there too >.< )

Did I mention I'm long-winded? I apologize but it is just how I am. I like long explanations, as I like long games. Nothing makes me happier then sitting in front of my comp and whiling away hours of my life playing a great game. So of yet, I haven't found one that truly holds my attention for any extended period. Most of them I gave to friends, or they sit on my game shelf collecting dust. Example: Civ 5. Decent game, but lacks a lot of replayability value.

For the sake of completeness, and convience I'll place all the ideas I've shared so far into this thread.

On the Imbue Debate -(posted by Mtrixis)

Ok...my opinion is, if Channellers are the only ones who can tap into magical forces, why bother giving spell-related perks to Champions who are unrecruited at all? I like the Imbue system myself, but they shouldn't have like, Fire Disciple before someone hires them, Imbues them and then they gain a level and select that perk. Or if you're going to give one of those perks to a Champion, make it so they're carrying a tiny shard of one of the big elemental crystals that is the source of their perk. One you could take away if you felt like it. 

Like I said, I like the Imbue system, but giving Champions affinity for magic before they are Imbued is basically countering your fiction about Channellers being the only ones who can use it.

On the Cloud Walk spell discussion -(also posted by Mtrixis)

Well...personally, I like Cloud Walk. Though it's name is deceptive. When I think of cloud walk, I think of normal moving but ignoring obstacles, hovering above the ground. In that context, you still need to move, but you get there faster cause you can zip over mountains rather then having to run around them. Could also make it so you can't be attacked while Cloud Walking(cept by ranged or spell-casting enemies), and it only has a duration of a few turns. Or you could set it up so while Cloud Walking, you can't be attacked at all, nor can you attack anything either. That way it won't get abused.

As far as teleporting goes...I've never seen a fantasy setting of any kind that didn't have it in some form. I'm a big D&D player, and teleporting is pretty important there, but it requires (normally) a high level member of the party who is a spellcaster to cast it, or to purchase the teleportation from an experienced NPC. Instead of totally killing the teleportation concept, as I think it's a bad idea - make it limited to a certain number of panels, not anywhere in your control zones. Higher mana cost would help straighten it out too. Say around 100-200, and it lets you jump 20 panels, and onto into areas you've explored. 

Course, with the current casting system you could jump from one side of the map to the other after casting a dozen times...but do you want to spend the 2000+ mana to do it or not? That way it's still pretty powerful, but not totally broken, as I dunno anyone that can easily cough up 2000 mana without batting an eyelash. But - for people that like working with one stack of strong units, it doesn't totally destroy their ability to protect their land if they accidentally forgot to put enough defenders in a city, or if a city is taken and they need it back right away.

On the tech tree discussion -(posted by Lord Xia)

I disagree. The story behind Elemental is the land is devastated after the war, and the world is left a smoking ruin, and one would expect that (being in a classical-type age) most knowledge on how to do things went with the people who knew it best. So you need people to research these things again, and recover the lost knowledge from before the world was reduced to ruin. I think the tech trees could use a more advanced approach, like instead of just clicking on a bar in a window and it starts working on it, you put a certain amount of resources toward the development of newer things. With this sacrifice, I would suggest that technological advances be strengthened since they take more effort to get. That way each advance *means* something. And they're important, rather then just a hurdling stone we have to jump over.

That's my opinion anyway.

I also agree with xalt about making diverse technologies available via different methods. I don't think any should be random at game start however...

For the others... I see where you're coming from, but I still disagree. Yes, there are some survivors of the cataclysm. Most the champions you meet however, are not craftsmen. If you wanted to go the route of starting with everything and just needing resources for it, it takes away from the pacing of the game. It's more of an RTS feature, rather then a TBS one. Personally, I wouldn't feel like I had accomplished much of anything if I just needed to go kill those few things and wow nifty sword. Sure, you can still get nifty swords, but they're looted items, rather then one you just have waiting back at the city. One of the biggest joys in a TBS game is the diversity that tech trees allow. If everyone has the same exact playing field, the ability to make everything without research, I would find that boring. If I wanted that kind of game I'd go play Star Craft. (Star Craft is a good game, but I can't spend hours enjoying it like I did WoM or Civ)

Now, a compromise...your soverign starts out - say you're playing Ceresa. She's a mage. Do you think she knows how to work a forge? Doubt it. I could see the leader of Guilden knowing some about it though. I believe thats where racial starting traits came about. I think starting techs should be limited to what your leader would know about since in the beginning it's just the sov vs the world. This would include adding more to a character creation system so that custom leaders could have a certain tree available to them at start. 

Over the course of the game, say you could meet NPCs/Champions who know other tech trees. In order to utilize them, they'd need to be hired on. Also, it would make more sense that if you were researching, that the champion that has that knowledge would have to be in a city and have proper facilities to do their research at. Also, you could find old blueprints from loots that unlock trees but still require a worker to do it. Alternately, you could have a hero/sov teach their basic knowledge to an expensive trainable unit called an Expert or something...who can stay in the city and do the research for you.

Now for the sake of not screwing people out of being able to start and get going, there should be base trees that every race starts with. The three available now are very broad ideas that cover a lot of topics. Going back to my Ceresa example, she may not know how to work a forge, but she would know the value of equipping her troops with good weapons. She would also know, being that she wishes to rule, about some basic techniques that would allow her to do so more efficiently. Being a mage, she would also (obviously) understand the importance and have some ideas on how to better use magic. Difference of knowledge vs common sense for the base 3 trees. I do think there should be sub-trees accessible under each one that are unlocked by items, or knowledge of certain npcs/champions that you hire on.

Basically - more specific example. The Warfare tree. It has to do with war. Okay? So what is war. War is a conflict. There really isn't much to war when just describing it as war. In terms of a tech tree, it should also not be as all-inclusive as it is. (btw, I like micro-management somewhat)

So...say you like spears. They're nifty. You stab people with them. Well, as a sub-tree of tech under Warfare should be something like Spear-Crafting. With more and deadly objects your artisans could learn to make, to hand to your soldiers to stick people with. Now you have a tree of spear items you can learn to make.

I hear the argument already. "Why learn to make? You have a blacksmith who provides the tree to do it! Why can't I just make my super person-sticker item NOW?!" Well, going back to the fiction. The Cataclysm. That blacksmith you hired on has probably been running for his life from random roving beasts and bandits and depraved survivors since then. He's probably a little bit rusty. So hire him, house him, build a nifty smithy for him and let him get back into practise by giving him metal and such to tinker with. Thus the tech-tree progression. 

In the same breadth, you make can make very powerful types of units using your super-person sticker weapon when the blacksmith has gotten back into the swing of things. It makes the game more diverse. Instead of having 'Oak Spear', you could have "Mitrhil Spear' or "Legendary Ebony Spear of DOOM' on your side rather then just...'Oak Spear'. Which is the same thing your enemy has if they have just basic equipment. Also, each tech-tree advancement could be more player-sensitive. Say your super-person sticker item you want in the end does tons and tons of damage...but weighs a LOT. While the other guy could go a more middling, or a light approach for less damage but more mobility.

I'm just throwing ideas out here, fellas so don't take any of my commentary personally. I believe tech trees are an important part of playing Elemental. If they removed them, much of the draw of the game would be gone for me. I like the feeling of accomplishment when I can finally do things I could not before, or build things I didn't have the knowledge to do previously. It makes the game more fulfilling, rather then just a mind-numbing, 'race for materials then go slaughter the other guy' fest that RTS games are.

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Ok, those are the lion share of things I've shared thus far. I have lots more ideas too, though the desire to post them is decidedly low due to lack of commenting on them (I swear people auto-ignore someone with no karma like me). Though for the purposes of this post, since it is an expression of my truest and strongest wishes that FE becomes a blinding success rather then another 'meh' game in the market I will put my personal feelings aside.

Issues that need addressing most - bugs/balance are obviously a big deal...no one likes them, as well as crashes. As far as adding new content to a game, you will always run into them, which will periodically need squishing. So this is more of a back-burner side to my discussion. We all know it's importance, no reason to beat the idea into submission.

Onto the body of this message:

1 - I like the fiction of Elemental, but there are times you shoot yourselves in the foot with information or things in the game that undermine the fiction. Biggest example I can make is the tech tree as it is, secondary would be included in with the Imbue page. I find it hard to take the game seriously if bits and pieces of the game ignore the history/fiction of the world. (btw, I'm a writer...these things erk me)

2 - More realism. Yes, I know it's a game. We all know it's a game. But does it have to feel like one? Personally, I don't think so. I'd like to feel like I'm in the shoes of my soveriegn, and have decisions to make that will impact the world because at my fingertips I have the power to alter reality. Examples of how this can be accomplished: make it so there are governing decisions you have to make every other year or so. Personally, I would like to see the game pace slowed down. Rather then 1 turn = 1 season, make it a week or a month. It would make things make more sense. Reason why this is - you've just started. You have founded your first city. Accessing your build menu you find... "hey look a Workshop! It'll help me build other things faster! I like it!" so you build it. It takes 8 turns. It really took 2 YEARS of a concentrated effort of all your workers to make it? HOLY ****. 8 turns using a weekly system...it just makes it more realistic in that, if you have your whole community working on it...it shouldn't take 2 years. Secondly on this same note...where do all these people who comprise your starting kingdom come from? To they just kind of poof out of thin air? Or do they somehow feel it, and go to where you've got this little patch of green(or purple) earth? That part makes me kind of ehh. I wish you would include like...survivor camps that you need to find and recruit before you can even make your first city. (or the sake of not screwing people I'd propose one be placed near each starting location, though.) By slowing the pacing down to a weekly or monthly basis it would also allow you to expand on the fiction, create a calendar with names for each months, maybe certain holidays during certain weeks. 

3 - Make it Alive - Yep...the world is dead. Certainly. The titans blew it up, well, most of it. The role of the sovereign is to bring life back. Or at least their own perverted idea of life. That's why the terrain changes around your cities, does it not? Then why doesn't it feel alive. Say that a kingdom ruler brings life back to a section of the world...that's pretty nifty. Green grass...green trees. Happiness. Not really. Sure, it is *nifty* but it could be done better. Rather then just bringing plants back to life, why not animals. I'd like to zoom in really far and see like...a rabbit hiding in that forest hex, make it move, make it eat something. I mean, you can't have plants without animals. Otherwise everything would get overgrown eventually unless you just went and clear-cut all the trees and scorched the earth yourself. But that doesn't go along with the idea of returning of life to the world. If making that kind of alteration to the world map would be too difficult, then I'd suggest implementing an area sort of map, like with my camping idea (stated in one of my other posts above).

4 - Interaction - Currently...all you really interact with are other sovereigns, the merchant from town, and quest givers/champions. Of course we all see the importance of this. Sometimes its better to make a peace treaty then randomly and only be able to attack our neighbors. Buying new gear is nifty. Completing quests is nifty too. But it all is so bland...like the pleas of your people aren't important. Or who cares what that champion thinks after you've forked over their hiring fee. Seems to me that the little things are totally ignored/forgotten/deemed pointless. It takes away from the game. I want to sit at council and discuss the realm with prominent citizens. I want to hear my champion tell me about his life since coming to work for me. I'd like to go sit at that fancy pub I made and chat with the barkeep about local stories. Or hit on a barmaid. I'd like that peasant to come up to me and complain about wild animals getting into his field and offer him some suggestions/resources to solve the problem. OR be elitist and tell him to take a hike cause you don't trouble with your problems, filthy peasant!  Say I was out in the field, got knocked out and had to teleport home to heal. I'd like my maids or medic fussing over me and berating me for putting myself in such danger. I'd like to hear the occasional grumble from the soldiers about hardships during training before completion. These kind of interactions are what really brings the world to life.

5 - Combat - Tactical combat could be better. Like...archers can be really efficient if the lay of the land helps them. I don't see an arrow going through that hill in the middle of the map. I also see a much larger playing field, where you can set traps and lay in wait behind obstacles that mess up line of sight. Or using natural things to your advantage...like say you could actually travel through a chasm. Say monsters could. Say you knew they were coming from the chasm cause of scouts informing you. What's to say...stop you from rolling boulders off the edge of the chasm onto them as they approach? Features like that would make combat more entertaining. Alternately, monsters could do the same things to you, making you have to be more cautious where and how you move your soldiers.

6 - Magic - Now, I like the magic system fairly well, but it could use improvement, as most things could. You've made a lot of spells. Yes, you have! But not enough. Being an avid D&D player, I like to be able to do all kinds of things with magic. From lighting up the enemy soldiers with fireball to...using mage hand to open that door. I'd like to see a generalist kind of elemental shard. Similiar to force from D&D but basically it's un-typed non-elemental magical energy. I also disagree with Life being only usable by Kingdom and death only usable by Empire. I've seen people use necromancy for good reasons and life energy used for bad reasons. (like over-healing someone to the point of exploding. Ouch.) With how magical the world is supposed to be...you would imagine that there are lots more applications for it. 

7- Immersion - Big point... if I don't feel like I'm in the world, and I have no way of really interacting with it, I just don't feel the game. Sure, I cast create mountain. BAM. Look, I made a mountain. That's nice. Would provide a tactical advantage not to have to protect there. But I don't feel any repercussions for it. Make it so my world-altering actions have some kind of consequences. If ya poof a mountain out of nowhere...where does the earth come from that comprises it? I think a tile or two being ripped out of the map to form the mountain would be better, and a shame if there was a valuable resource on that spot that was used. Or if it was part your city was sitting on. Long and short...I want to feel like...I am there. Rather then just watching from my computer chair.

8 - Light and Dark - In the same breadth as much of my post...there should be good choices, neutral choices, and bad ones. I should be free to choose between them as I interact with the world. Say that...in early turns I got knocked unconscious by wildlings as a kingdom player. Say that made me really mad, so I put a bounty up for every wildling head that was brought to me. Say eventually wildlings were made extinct from this. Or, create a way of governing...one I could use that sends out scouts/runners to bring the poor, the downtrodden from other kingdoms/empires and the wilds to come make their homes in my city. This would obviously start to tax food production being able to cover population after a time. But in terms of RP...it is a pretty charitable thing to do.

9 - [To be added as I come up with more ideas]

Now I realize...what I am suggesting is a programmer's nightmare. There is so much more that can be done with FE, so much more that would make it one of the games that critics would be raving about, and would skyrocket sales charts and be remembered and recounted for years down the road about it's greatness. As it currently is...I don't see that happening. It's almost reinventing the wheel, but I am sure everything here could be accomplished from adding new scenes, dialogues, or via scripting. Had I the knowledge of such things myself I would offer my assistance, but alas I am just a weary game-player who is seeking for some shining gem among the garbage and silt of today's gaming market. I truly do wish FE to be a shining success, and that is what has led me to devoting several hours into compiling these ideas and typing them down. I wouldn't spend my time this way if I truly thought it was a waste...but I must cling to the glimmer of a hope that perhaps someone will read this, and actually comment. Perhaps even be inspired by it themselves when it comes to release time and create a mod with some of these features.