We need your opinion re: city build mode zoom options

By on January 20, 2012 4:01:05 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Kestral2040

Join Date 02/2009
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Hey guys!  First off, glad to see you seem to be (for the most part) enjoying the beta!  We have a question for you guys about a specific UI feature we have, the city build mode zoom option.  For those that don't know, in the general options there is an option to turn on "city build mode zoom".  What this does is make it so when you build something you get a transition into a different, birds-eye, view of the city in question.

Internally there are differing opinions on what we think of this mode and we would like to see what you guys think about it.  In order to see what I mean follow these steps:

 

1: Enable the mode in general options http://screencast.com/t/m0MsKHblJsQ 

2: Build something in a city! http://screencast.com/t/uERqR5q8U4I

3: This is what the standard build view is with the option off for reference http://screencast.com/t/E3H6fqsU

 

I would prefer if you guys actually try using the mode yourself for a while before you vote, seeing it static is different from in the game with animation and in different situations.  Obviously you don't HAVE to, but you may feel differently late in the game or something. 

 

As a final note, no matter what the result of the vote this feature (and the ability to turn it off) will remain in the game.  So however you feel about it, don't worry you will be able to play as you like; I mean this is a PC game, not being able to play how you want is more of a console thing  this is just going to help us decide how our default experience is for new users.

Click here to vote

Thanks!

-Toby

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January 20, 2012 5:12:50 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I chose off, but what I think most people would really like is a close-up view at an angle that gives us a more personal perspective of the city. The current iteration is very good for placement, but I feel that cities are mostly taken for granted by the endgame. Giving us a little up-close spin around the city and then an angled view from which to build would remind us of all the cool stuff we have been building. 

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January 20, 2012 5:16:35 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

On. Now add a link/button to the tile editor and let us design our own buildings for our factions please . Also, I notice on the world map I can't zoom in so close as to see my peasants anymore. I miss that. Seeing people walk the streets of my cities was nice.

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January 20, 2012 5:25:49 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I don't see the harm in keeping the option.

I used to play with the option on in E:wom, but I don't like it at all now in FE due to the locked camera angle - it makes the camera move much more than it did in E:wom when I was often watching from above already.

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January 20, 2012 5:33:43 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Heavenfall,
  in FE due to the locked camera angle

There's a togle in the options for that bro. It's the "snap back" one. Un-check it and you have your free cam back, you just can't zoom in quite as far as before. I'm sure that's easily changeable in XML though. Still, not having tried to change it yet I wonder if when I do and I zoom in closer are my wandering peasants still there in my cities?

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January 20, 2012 5:39:30 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I realize there is that option, but I LIKE the option on.

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January 20, 2012 5:43:41 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I preferred the city zoom because it makes it a lot easier to see where you're placing buildings. It will probably also help to draw attention to the fact that you have to actual position the building which could be confusing to new players.

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January 20, 2012 5:44:09 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I choose off but... exactly how seanw3 wrote. I'd use it if it was really focus+some zoom when leaving the angle unchanged. And I also vote in invisible survey for working "Disable zoom limit" and "Scroll at edges" options 

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January 20, 2012 5:59:04 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting RavenX,
Now add a link/button to the tile editor and let us design our own buildings for our factions please.
That would be cool! An option to design or alter buildings as we queue them. I don't think I'd frequently use it, but there'd surely be times I would.

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January 20, 2012 7:45:15 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Just my 2 cents:  I just tried it and discovered I liked it turned on.  It's definitely an improvement to having it turned off.

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January 20, 2012 8:02:43 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I don't mind either way but I like to have it on.

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January 20, 2012 9:30:47 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I play almost entirely in clothmap, but I prefer it off. Is it hard to see positions with the non-clothmap?

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January 21, 2012 2:49:28 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Just played around with it. Am not a fan. It seems to jerk you out of your normal play experience to much, almost like a cut scene every time you want to build.  I have no problem with the option being included though especially if we manage to make building placement mean something.

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January 21, 2012 3:39:02 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums


I prefer it on because placing buildings is quite hard otherwise, and it's not at all obvious you are in "place building mode".

Also if you have the city hud turned on, which I like, it block half the placement area while in zoomed in mode it's not a big problem.

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January 21, 2012 10:01:51 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums


i agree with seansw3. i prefer on, just for placement purposes. i second the "scroll at edges" vote.

 

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January 21, 2012 2:26:25 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Howdy,

I do not see a use for it.  Reasoning, I can rotate the map to my comfort and if I want to look nadir I can rotate to that degree.  If its useful to others then leave it in.  Personally, I place buildings anywhere because the placement does not effect output, other then river, lumber and resources.  Hypothetical example, if the placement of a Pub within X distance of the Inn effected growth then city planning would be much more though out, and use of the city zoom might come more into play, when long term city planing was part of game play. 

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January 21, 2012 2:41:17 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Personally I'd prefer to see it all go away and just have the game place the city. Let players who want to customize the layout be able to turn it on and such but the default would be to just have no grid or anything but just place the improvement in the queue.

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January 21, 2012 2:52:01 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Frogboy,
Personally I'd prefer to see it all go away and just have the game place the city. Let players who want to customize the layout be able to turn it on and such but the default would be to just have no grid or anything but just place the improvement in the queue.

Just posted on this in another thread. I tend to agree - struggling to find good practical reasons to micro the placements (outside closing strategic chokepoints and/or bringing resources within city proper) and when I get FE, will probably just let the game place. This is coming from a guy who micro'd everything in EWOM.

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January 21, 2012 4:19:32 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I like choosing building placement. I wouldn't have thought so, but I do. 

As others have said, it would add interest if placement was gameplay governed versus purely aesthetic. Lumbermills in forests, quarries on hills, peat harvesting at swamps etc. Each of those yielding generic Material. For Food there's hunting lodge in forests, gator ponds at swamps, fisherman's wharf along rivers and coast. This may also help with city specialization if there are more building options than any given city could build/afford.

If not for the core game, then mods? 

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January 21, 2012 4:47:59 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Frogboy,
Personally I'd prefer to see it all go away and just have the game place the city. Let players who want to customize the layout be able to turn it on and such but the default would be to just have no grid or anything but just place the improvement in the queue.

Old School. It was good for it's day. It was a good mechanic in MoM and Age of Wonders as well. With all the work that's went into making it possible in Elemental though would you really want to scrap that and go backwards? 0.o

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January 22, 2012 12:19:32 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I've been using off in my latest game & while it is more pleasing visually, it's just to darn hard to place improvements where you want them, even zoomed in.

Elements of the city title get in the way and view angle distorts.

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January 22, 2012 7:04:09 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I didn't use it before seeing that post. And now I can't build without it. So +1 for the zoom when building.

 

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January 22, 2012 9:20:52 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I never use it and find placing building an unnecessary feature. I second Brad's idea to make placements automatically and leave the option to place building in for the people who really want it.

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January 22, 2012 9:28:07 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Get rid of it entirely, waste of time. Unless there's a gameplay element to placing city tiles (which I doubt I'd want to deal with, given the number of cities you potentially have to manage), it currently serves no useful purpose.

There are also some stupid, exploitish behaviors with city spread right now, as units can travel through an entire lengthy city in one turn (but not if the city is full, and cities can engulf resources, which then use the cities build queue, instead of their own). It's a buggy mess.

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January 22, 2012 10:10:37 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Mtrixis,
Get rid of it entirely, waste of time. Unless there's a gameplay element to placing city tiles (which I doubt I'd want to deal with, given the number of cities you potentially have to manage), it currently serves no useful purpose.

There are also some stupid, exploitish behaviors with city spread right now, as units can travel through an entire lengthy city in one turn (but not if the city is full, and cities can engulf resources, which then use the cities build queue, instead of their own). It's a buggy mess.

Nooooooo. That's a horrid idea, I'm sorry but I don't agree. I see taking it out as taking away a whole level of detail from the game. For those of us who like it, it's there. For those who don't, it doesn't matter and you can put a building anywhere without consequence because it really doesn't matter what building is next to which.

I do agree of course that any abuse or bugs in it should be fixed, but scrapping the concept is really uncalled for when so many people enjoy it. Why do you think so many people want the Dynasty System back? Because it was another layer of detail, of depth, that made the game fun (to those who enjoyed it).

FE is really Elemental with OOMPH. A new UI, better presentation, better combat mechanics, better just about everything that's present in the game. Now what it needs is to have that same "FE Treatment/Upgrade" applied to the City Building system and the Dynasty System and then we'll have what I think most of us would consider a complete package, combining much of the original intent of Elemental with the awesomeness that is FE.

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January 22, 2012 10:15:18 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting RavenX,

Quoting Mtrixis, reply 23Get rid of it entirely, waste of time. Unless there's a gameplay element to placing city tiles (which I doubt I'd want to deal with, given the number of cities you potentially have to manage), it currently serves no useful purpose.

There are also some stupid, exploitish behaviors with city spread right now, as units can travel through an entire lengthy city in one turn (but not if the city is full, and cities can engulf resources, which then use the cities build queue, instead of their own). It's a buggy mess.

Nooooooo. That's a horrid idea, I'm sorry but I don't agree. I see taking it out as taking away a whole level of detail from the game. For those of us who like it, it's there. For those who don't, it doesn't matter and you can put a building anywhere without consequence because it really doesn't matter what building is next to which.

I do agree of course that any abuse or bugs in it should be fixed, but scrapping the concept is really uncalled for when so many people enjoy it. Why do you think so many people want the Dynasty System back? Because it was another layer of detail, of depth, that made the game fun (to those who enjoyed it).

FE is really Elemental with OOMPH. A new UI, better presentation, better combat mechanics, better just about everything that's present in the game. Now what it needs is to have that same "FE Treatment/Upgrade" applied to the City Building system and the Dynasty System and then we'll have what I think most of us would consider a complete package, combining much of the original intent of Elemental with the awesomeness that is FE.

That's why I'm glad you're still there. You steal my words.

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