The Grand Demandobot AI Thread

By on January 27, 2011 2:50:48 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Vallu751

Join Date 05/2003
+14

We are the Demandobots   http://forums.elementalgame.com/404518/page/1/#2876891

It is our nature to relentlessly demand AI improvements.

Our programming has the following rules:

1. We demand specific improvements. Those making vague demands are not true demandobots! Elaborate to prove your worth!

2. We provide savegames by dropbox or similar technology to offer others a chance to share in the mockery of the puny AI's feeble attempts at gameplay. (And to help the devs)

3. We separate issues and requests into "Community confirmed", "Needs confirmation" and "Too vague, please elaborate".

4. Our programming is quite moddable, please make improvement suggestions if you feel like it.

And finally, Rule zero: We cheer AI improvements mightily.

 

STRATEGIC AI

Top priority:

Champion AI concidered lacking because of the following two issues.

HeavenFall, Vandenburg, Lord Xia, nitey47, AlLanMandragoran: AI won't equip new items. If they hire champions, they will never have better equipment than what they start with.

  • Apparently somewhat improved with 1.19n?

Stuie, Lord Xia: AI does not take stat upgrades at level-up http://forums.elementalgame.com/404479

AlLanMandragoran: AI gets "pop-locked" and doesn't do anything for many turns. http://forums.elementalgame.com/407995

Community confirmed:

AlLanMandragoran: Most recent strategic AI analysis thread: http://forums.elementalgame.com/407995

AlLanMandragoran: AI leaves settlements undefended. Also, has unused pioneers and is building more in the same location. http://forums.elementalgame.com/408391

AlLanMandragoran: AI building cities on top of resources. http://forums.elementalgame.com/408401

Vandenburg, nitey: Rushing military (techs) too powerful http://forums.elementalgame.com/403879/page/9/#2877482

Lord Xia: AI could group better, instead of two groups of 4 units coming after a city, and both failing, one group of 8 would have succeeded

Sethai: Teleport allows human players to concentrate their forces better than an AI. AI doesn't build groups or archers. their huge armies of individuals are destroyed by area spells. http://forums.elementalgame.com/407978/page/1/#2927950

Yosarian2:  AI will consistantly declare war on me, and then completly ignore me and do nothing for dozens of turns. The AI just needs to learn to properly launch a single large attack on nearby cities it's at war with. http://forums.elementalgame.com/407978/get;2928071

Yosarian2: I often conquer cities that have the wrong buildings (for example, it'll build the buildings that give a % bonus to metal production in cities that have no metal production.) http://forums.elementalgame.com/407978/get;2928071

impinc, Tydorius: Poor maneuvering. AI always moves units in the same turn order every time.  AI never uses the pass turn to just stand still, even if using its turns moves it backwards. http://forums.elementalgame.com/404507

  • Partial fix suggestion by Tydorius: Allow units to move through other units as long as the other side is clear.

HeavenFall, Lord Xia: AI uses mounts very, very rarely

 

TheProgress, kaitro AI does not defend improvement tiles.: The AI continues to rebuild improvements whilst enemies are right next to the improvement tile. http://forums.elementalgame.com/404551

TheProgress: The AI retreats (on the strategic map) when it has superiority in numbers and strength. Link to saves: http://filebin.ca/kpaeyt/Saves.zip

  • Related to: TheProgress: strategic AI commands an empire that has a power rating 5x higher than that of my own - they declare war on me - 100 turns later, I have yet to even see a single attack made by them.

Blackmantle_: AI gives obscene amounts of Gildar for diplomatic capital during diplomatic negotiations (treaties part of the negotation-table) while giving the diplomatic capital away for cheap when bartering for goods. The richer the AI is, the worse the bug

HeavenFall, Sythion: AI attacks a city with 400 combat rating worth of units in, with an army that has 80 combat rating. AI  tactics about when and where to fight are poor.

Blackmantle_, Sythion: AI seems to undervalue hiring heroes. Ridiculous AI may have thousands of gildar, but there are still heroes available in AI territory or just near it. AI needs to focus on champions early game, since they are much easier to purchase and buff up (only need gold)

nitey47, vallu751: Combat rating needs improvement. Is defensive armor given enough weight? Are magical effects values? Spellcasters?

  • Example: force of 5 spiders with combat rating 39 attacked with three lower end units (Boar spear, some padded armor) combat rating 29. Overwhelming victory. 
  • Another game, 5 spiders vs sovereign and 4 other units. Sov stack had all values - especially defense - higher, but combat ratings were the same. Spiders were barely able to scratch.

nitey47, HeavenFall: AI creates too many monuments. 8 or 9 in a city, each taking 10 pop.

nitey47: AI build options could be better in general. Currently too many monuments and labor pits. Too few Studies and Schools.

Werewindlefr: AI does not build units with a shield and one handed weapon.

citywolfdreams: AI should keep low level heroes with fighting stacks, hanging out back to gain exp.

 

Needs confirmation:

EternalRequiem: AI doesn't cut down forests to make room for cities.

Vandenburg: AI doesn't phase out obsoleted units with better ones

Blackmantle_: AI gives more for a Hero on bartering than demanding for that same hero. Might be tied to recruit cost of the player as well as the AI and relations. So beeing a Bard with a high charisma might help to reproduce. The richer the AI is, the worse that bug

nitey: AI might do better against rushing if it researched an offensive spell right away

nitey: AI units should have better defense in the beginning, even normal peasants

Blackmantle_: AI doesn't seem able to keep watch of its heroes. They seem to die rather fast despite high difficulty HP bonuses

seanw3: I demand that the AI can logically research late game technologies (the ones that are infinite). I have not noticed a good use of this by the AI.

seanw3: I demand that the AI can cast spells. Even in 1.19 they seem to totally avoid magic.

seanw3: I demand that the AI can properly see that he is being beaten by my invincible armies and sign a peace treaty without demanding insane amounts of gold. Why is the winner supposed to pay for peace?

seanw3: I demand that the AI can raze a city if it is surrounded by too many units.

seanw3: I demand that the AI can ask me for help if it is losing a war and we are the same faction.

nitey47: AI does not use Imbue Hero, Arcane Weapon, Stone Skin, Regenerate or Heal on either their heroes or their sovereign. http://forums.elementalgame.com/404541/page/1/#2879022

nitey47: AI doesn't build archers after archery was moved up in tech tree.

seanw3: AI at a disadvantage at higher tech levels, doesn't seem to utilize them well

  • vallu751: Could this be related to the AI spending their materials in lower end stuff and creating a resource bottleneck? Or are they just not programmed to utilize the better stuff well?

Savoy3:  AI is not trying to trade with others to get for example metals. http://forums.elementalgame.com/408864

 

Too vague, please elaborate:

Vandenburg from demandobot thread: AI doesn't factor it in deciding for war (champion equipment or obsolete units? Both?)

 

TACTICAL AI

Community confirmed:

TheProgress, Sythion:  The tactical AI will focus all units on attacking a single enemy unit until the battle has ended regardless of how the enemy changes position or attacks. http://forums.elementalgame.com/404639

vallu751, Sythion: AI rushes to attack without considering who gets to strike first. Easy to exploit for a great advantage.

citywolfdreams: List of AI improvement suggestions in thread http://forums.elementalgame.com/405229

  • "Do we have more artillery?" - Ranged combat instead of charge if AI has better ranged strength
  • "What dangerous units does the enemy have and how can I best respond?" - Intelligent target picking
  • "Do I have regenerating creatures?" - Rotating units to take advantage of regen

 

NOTED IMPROVEMENTS

Fixes in 1.19:

nitey47: 1.19 beta: AI creating better units

Fixed by 1.19a that corrected a 1.19 problem with AI XML Tag usage:

Vandenburg, AlLanMandragoran: AI doesn't expand problem.

Trojasmic: How to beat 6 ridiculous AIs with saves and screenshots: http://forums.elementalgame.com/404770

Fixes in 1.19a:

AI: Fixed an issue with the sovereign not going out to pickup goodie huts.

Fixes in 1.19c:

Helsturm & others: 1.19b AI sovereign stationed near town, not inside. http://forums.elementalgame.com/405133

AlLanMandragoran: Faction AI XML tags for factions other than Umber.

Fixes in 1.19d:

Patch notes: AI suicidal tendencies reduced

 


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bbr91
Stuie_
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February 4, 2011 8:29:47 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Yeah, Brad mentions it was fixed here:

http://forums.elementalgame.com/404770

 

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February 4, 2011 8:29:48 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

They said it would be, but I can't verify that it has. Their word should be sufficient.

Edit: Beaten to the punch, with a source no less! My forum-fu is degrading.

14:29:47

14:29:48

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February 4, 2011 8:37:10 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Thank you both. I'll update the thread a bit later. On the road right now..

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February 5, 2011 2:29:25 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I performed an analysis of how the AI gears their sovereigns, spouses, and champions in 1.19a here:

http://forums.elementalgame.com/404914

Summary of Observations:

  • The observations are clear: the AI is not gearing sovereigns, spouses, or champions despite available tech levels and gildar.
  • Furthermore, a number of anomalies were noted where the AI did gear beyond observable tech levels. Something is weird there. Unknown if due to a programmed handicap.
  • Gearing armor is especially weak, in fact almost non-existent. The anomalies observed were minor slot improvements, not entire sets.

Recommendations:

  • AI needs to agressively check and gear sovereigns, spouses, and champions. Reasons are self-evident. I believe this is a fundamental reason why the more hardcore players are able to rush early and dominate the game - its easy to take over an enemy capital when the AI is fighting in their birthday suit. The AI needs to spend like a woman with a credit card (sorry women!). The AI is fighting players with normal units - not heroes. That's a serious gimp.
  • In addition, the AI needs to do what us players do: if a unit/stack is about to engage in combat, buff the unit/stack with arcane weapon and then dispel when no longer needed (please note arcane weapon is a 1 mana spell with unlimited cast range and 1 mana maintenance). If the AI geared their heroes and also buffed with arcane weapon, I guarantee it would help counter the early rush and make the games more competitive.
  • As noted in my strategic AI thread the AI needs to agressively hire champions and explore/level their sovereigns and spouses. The combination of gearing, leveling, and buffing/dispelling arcane weapon would be a serious early game threat to players.
  • Let's put some meaning behind the ridiculous in ridiculous AI setting!
  • Brad, Derek and crew (and you too Jon), thank you!

 

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February 5, 2011 2:31:30 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Heavenfall,
They said it would be, but I can't verify that it has. Their word should be sufficient.

Edit: Beaten to the punch, with a source no less! My forum-fu is degrading.


14:29:47



14:29:48



LOL - I just noticed the 1 second difference.

 

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February 5, 2011 10:33:28 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Brad or Derek,

Can you please share the formula for how both faction power and unit/stack power is calculated? This could help the community understand how/why the AI is making decisions around going to war or deciding if battles are winnable. We might be able to help out here.

Thanks.

 

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February 5, 2011 12:23:59 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I'm starting a play by play analysis of a 1.19a ridiculous game here:

Seasons 1-20: http://forums.elementalgame.com/404927

Seasons 21-40: http://forums.elementalgame.com/404944

This is a work in progress until next patch where I'll then terminate and start over.

Brad - please take the time to read through these. Lots of good stuff in there. If you want, skip to the end of 21-40 and see how/why Altar is dead in season 41.

Seasons 41-60: http://forums.elementalgame.com/404949

Seasons 61+: http://forums.elementalgame.com/404982

 

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February 7, 2011 8:19:14 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

great to see all of this stuff being seriously documented and hopefully worked on.

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February 8, 2011 1:54:49 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Are the AI's configured via an XML file? That is each leader has an XML file that would configure their likes and dislikes in terms of troop types upgrades, use of spells and build order? Is it possible for us to configure the npc leaders via a configurator of some sort that would let us custom build NPC leaders to fight?

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February 11, 2011 12:58:46 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

1.19b Strategic Analysis here: http://forums.elementalgame.com/405148

Summary of Observations:

  • URGENT PROBLEM: apparent broken xml tags with Capitar, Pariden, Gilden, possible Umber (unknown if Umber has problems since played as Umber)
  • Great improvement on goodie huts since 1.19a - but I noticed ungeared sov's exploring and getting smacked around by mobs (that's dangerous since the entire empire will collapse if they die, no fun for your enemy to just go "poof!")
  • Some spouses remain stacked on city but not within city
  • Altar is the only spouse that left the capital
  • Recommend giving sovereigns and spouses xp per turn or have them explore the world (being careful of course)
  • Cursory pass - spouses or sov's are still not being geared per gildar and tech levels
  • AI doesn't seem to weight housing as much as it should - i.e. on ridiculous why does it need a workshop or other improvement before housing when it has 10+ prestige a turn and all the other bonuses? Recommend AI on ridiculous is hardcoded to build x number of housing units or get population to y value before building anything else.
  • AI seems to randomly leave the unit or improvement queues empty on occasion - they should be building nonstop on ridiculous due to the resource buffs. Recommend some kind of check is done to ensure those queues never remain empty.
  • Tarth's pioneers just sat there next to city and wouldn't settle (pathing?)
  • Other than the serious problems with apparent broken xml tags, I had more "nones" this go around and it appears the AI is hiring champions more often. If the AI would just keep the sovereign, spouse, and champions geared it would go a long way to making the AI competitive.

Brad - thanks for the work on the goodie huts. Can you please figure out what's wrong with those factions noted above and help the AI gear the champions? Thanks!

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February 11, 2011 1:55:11 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Great stuff AlLanMandragoran! I won't be copying everything to the list, I'll just keep your thread link on top of Community Confirmed list to make sure it's seen.

I've got a "Top Priority" list on top of everything else. Right now the champion problems are there because it seems like the AI is not handling AI levels and equipment at all. Personally I believe right after that should come strategic AI stuff you're exploring and the tactical AI targetting a single unit and forgetting everything else.

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February 15, 2011 5:21:14 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I started a thread about tactical combat (http://forums.elementalgame.com/405229) which turned into a discussion about ways to improve both tactical combat and how the AI behaves there.  One of the respondents pointed out that this related thread would be a good place to have the discussion, so I am posted a link here.  (Apologies if this is not standard forum protocol - I'm new.

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February 16, 2011 3:22:07 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Thanks citywolfdreams!

I'll add your AI observations from the post.

And don't worry about forum protocol, you're doing just fine. We're all newbies here, I just registered in 2003 

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February 17, 2011 11:56:52 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

1.19c Strategic Analysis here: http://forums.elementalgame.com/405436

Summary of Observations:

  • URGENT PROBLEM: apparent broken xml tags with Umber. They'd rather smoke weed instead of conquering the world. Kraxis, Tarth, & Capitar all looked like they were puff puff givin' but then amazingly decided to get off their butts in the later seasons. They must have had bills to pay.
  • All sov's are grabbing goodie huts. Yay!
  • None of the spouses are sitting on a city but not in a city. Yay!
  • Recommend giving sovereigns and spouses xp per turn or have them explore the world (being careful of course)
  • Cursory pass - spouses or sov's are still not being geared per gildar and tech levels. If the spouses are just going to camp the capitals (which is fine with me as a defensive unit) then please max gear them based on gildar and tech levels.
  • Still recommend weighting housing higher on the priority list, at least until their cities hit level 3.
  • AI seems to randomly leave the unit or improvement queues empty on occasion but this appears to happen less often than prior builds. Yay!
  • It also appears that the FP calculations may have been tweaked down a bit - not sure since I have no idea how previous or current FP's are calculated. I have a feeling the resource buffs on ridiculous may have contributed to previous builds FP being really high, thus causing the AI to do stupid diplomatic and warfare decisions. When I start a real game I'll see if my assumptions are correct.
  • The "nones" have improved further from 1.19b. A few factions looked like they were completely pop locked at 5 but then recovered. Only saw one instance of an available champion not hired which is another positive.

Brad & Crew - Please get those memory issues fixed and start gearing sovereigns, spouses, and champions. Thanks!

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February 18, 2011 2:59:33 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Great work as always AlLanMandragoran! I updated the top link of Community Confirmed to your newest thread.

Glad to see other factions fixed. Have you tried another game to see if it's again just Umber that's smoking weed?

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February 18, 2011 4:21:12 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Vallu751,
Great work as always AlLanMandragoran! I updated the top link of Community Confirmed to your newest thread.

Glad to see other factions fixed. Have you tried another game to see if it's again just Umber that's smoking weed?

Heh, I'll do another test this weekend and advise to see if there's consistency across factions or if issues vary across games.

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February 19, 2011 10:24:50 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Performed a second analysis of 1.19c here: http://forums.elementalgame.com/405436. Please see reply #1 to that thread.

Summary of Observations:

  • URGENT PROBLEM: Capitar was in a coma until S60 and then suddenly snapped out of it!
  • All sov's are grabbing goodie huts. Yay!
  • Tarth spouse was sitting on the capital in season 48 but that corrected itself by season 60.
  • Recommend giving sovereigns and spouses xp per turn or have them explore the world (being careful of course)
  • Cursory pass - spouses or sov's are still not being geared per gildar and tech levels. If the spouses are just going to camp the capitals (which is fine with me as a defensive unit) then please max gear them based on gildar and tech levels.
  • Still recommend weighting housing higher on the priority list, at least until their cities hit level 3.
  • AI seems to randomly leave the unit or improvement queues empty on occasion but this appears to happen less often than prior builds. The key thing here is new settlements - they found without escort (bad), start building a defensive unit (good), but it appears they leave the improvement queues empty for awhile (bad).
  • I don't think the FP scores have been tweaked based on this analysis. They looked like they did in 1.19b.
  • Altar made pioneers but they're not founding new settlements (pathing?). Tarth has not founded an additional city by S60.
  • Saw more available champions not being hired this time around.
  • Tarth & Pariden took awhile to found their kingdoms - not sure why.
  • Kraxis is playing a solid strategic game and passed all the things I look for - Capitar is without a doubt playing the worst, maybe they thought the rest of the AI needed a 5 year handicap. That's some arrogant behavior from Carrodus but that's how he rolls.

Brad - unsure why some factions act retarded, suspect broken xml tags. And of course gear sovereigns, spouses, and champions...blah blah blah.

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February 19, 2011 11:58:02 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Brad - here's a save of a real game I'm playing. Note Capitar pop locked at 5 and not doing a daggum thing. Consistent with my above test game. This is random medium map, ridiculous across the board, custom sov, normal pacing, max players. http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19969679/Elemental/119c/79.EleSav

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February 19, 2011 1:53:07 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Brad - same game as above. Note Kraxis sovereign suicide plunge into my kingdom despite an overwhelming advantage in FP, military technology, and unit quantity.

Please gear the sovereigns, spouses, and champions. Please also review their suicidal tendencies. It would also be nice to not have an entire empire/kingdom disappear if the sov does commit suicide. Just bringing this to your attention to constructively criticize in efforts to make the game better. Many thanks for you and your team's efforts!

[Edit] Brad - just some additional color around this situation. Kraxis had the edge to actually defeat me if they became agressive and force magnified. If you look at the quantity of units across their cities, they could have created a max stack (maybe even two) and invade. I was actually waiting for them to do that (hoping the AI would) - it could have caused me serious trouble. I would have had to get creative in tactical combat (i.e. use the fences in city tactical to allow only 1-2 of their units to attack at a time) and that still might not have gone my way. But instead their sovereign decided to stick his neck out.

  • Gear heroes
  • Eliminate suicide
  • Force magnify

Those three things above could have caused a loss or at least grinding retreat. Thanks!

Also - if it helps, I personally use the following logic for kingdom defense:

  • Always one unit defending a city - "safe" cities don't need massive stacks defending them
  • If on the perimeter (monster or faction invasion), minimum two units (preferably a tank and a melee/range)
  • If at war, stacking additional units on the fronts (redeploy units from safe cities to the perimeter/fronts
  • The goal is to civilize the land and eliminate the length of perimeters so units can force magnify on fronts

  

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February 19, 2011 2:00:49 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

+Karma to Mandragoran for his continuous (and painful) dance with the AI.

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February 21, 2011 1:53:28 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Brad - here's a season 164 save from 1.19c real game I mentioned above. Capitar finally got their act together (broke the pop lock jam) but it took around 140 seasons. Note their capital is now level 3 and they've created a pioneer. http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19969679/Elemental/119c/164.EleSav

I'm at war with Magnar but we're playing footsie together. They've sent a couple of threatening stacks that made me sweat a little. Just about done civilizing the southern portion of my kingdom then I'll probably dispatch Capitar then turn my attention to Magnar. Will advise if I see any crazy AI behavior.

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February 22, 2011 10:03:33 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Brad - Season 208 of the 1.19c real game. I have yet to turn my attention to Magnar but Capitar is now dead (put them out of their misery) and cleaning up remaining wastelands before turning my attention to Magnar and the rest of the map. My mid to end game steamroll is about to begin.

Please look at my 4 hero stack near the Food7 settlement and the latest weak Magnar stack sent my way. Power of my stack is 152 while his is 72. The fact they are building quality units is good yet they are not consolidating enough units in a stack to make a viable threat. A Magnar human player would consolidate units at Odoma and then push forward. It appears the stacks are deciding to prioritize something in my kingdom but ignoring the quadruple hero threat about to ram some metal up their behinds (this might also explain why Kraxis sovereign committed suicide earlier in the game). Can you please review what the AI is considering a priority here? Are they "seeing" something weak behind my perimeter and ignoring the more powerful perimeter units in their way? This seems to be a trend across games - I know I've seen other folks post similar concerns.

Anyway, something to look into to help make the AI more competitive. Thanks!

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19969679/Elemental/119c/208.EleSav

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February 24, 2011 12:55:07 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Brad - note this season 218 save. Magnar placed his semi-geared sovereign within range of my 6-hero stack on the eastern front (between my Food7 and Magnar's Odoma). Despite having several large and competitive normal stacks nearby, he's left his sov completely undefended and all I need to do is move in for the kill. This single decision isn't a game-ender as he'll survive and respawn in Odoma. But I could pursue him there next turn and end it. Please review the gearing and suicidal tendencies.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19969679/Elemental/119c/218.EleSav

[Edit] Interesting. When I loaded the game the sovereign disappeared from his location. Does the AI move units again on reload?

Derek - Touch of Entropy range check is broken. Although I commend the AI for using it, Magnar's sovereign spammed the spell at my heroes across the tactical map. Is this intended or a bug? Thanks.

[Editx2] Brad - In season 220 Magnar sent his almost naked daughter with one escort unit and placed her in the tile right next to my fully geared hero stack. I think he's trying to distract me with her beauty.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19969679/Elemental/119c/220.EleSav

 

 

 

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February 25, 2011 12:16:16 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

1.19d Strategic AI analysis here: http://forums.elementalgame.com/405730

Summary of Observations:

  • URGENT PROBLEM: Capitar was dead by season 24 due to monsters and ruffians. Stupid ninny must have tripped, hit his head, and then got eaten by a bear.
  • Pariden was acting completely retarded in two ways: spouse was sitting on a city but not in a city until season 48 and they looked completely pop locked (i.e. not doing a thing) until sometime between season 48 and 60. It must have been that time of the month for Procipinee.
  • Capitar & Gilden had not founded kingdoms by season 12. Capitar bit the big one, Gilden made a nice recovery.
  • Recommend giving sovereigns and spouses xp per turn or have them explore the world (being careful of course).
  • Cursory pass - spouses or sov's are still not being geared per gildar and tech levels. If the spouses are just going to camp the capitals (which is fine with me as a defensive unit) then please max gear them based on gildar and tech levels.
  • The AI is now hardly leaving any build queues empty! Yay!
  • The "nones" improved alot from 1.19c. In fact, it's now more common to see a "none" than the alternative. Yay!

Brad - great work, the "nones" are looking way better! Still have something going on with broken xml tags as Pariden should not have sat there for 10-12 years before doing anything. Capitar gets a Darwin award for dying by season 24. The housing criticism in season 12 across all factions is probably a bit unfair as I know they can't build housing until they have the mats and farm (900% bonuses to everything when they do, however). Overall looks like great progress. Thanks for the efforts!

P.S. - please gear the sovereigns, spouses, and champions. I don't remember if I mentioned that in prior posts. lol

 

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February 25, 2011 12:47:22 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting RFHolloway,
Love this approach - do we need a demandabot thread for game balance/improvements/general issues - or should we post things here?

New thread for Balance issues here http://forums.elementalgame.com/405729/#2894536

 

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