Diablo III

Hack 'n Slash 3.0

By on October 17, 2010 7:18:54 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

ZehDon

Join Date 04/2009
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With Blizzcon right around the corner, the Diablo III community is gearing up for what they are hoping is a release of new information, and hopefully a release window.  A lot about Diablo III is still unknown, with only vague details given to the community via the offical Battle.net forums.  The fifth and final class is yet to be anounced, the 'End Game' content - said to justify the lowered level cap of 60 - hasn't been discussed at all and of course the widespread concern for the general direction of the game has yet to be really addressed in any meaningful way.

I myself am a massive Diablo II fan; I still play it to this day.  While Torchlight kicked the original Diablo out of the picture entirely, and it's sequel hoping to finally kick Diablo II off of it's throne, Diablo II is still the best Hack 'n Slash money can buy.  World of Warcraft used it's item and 'drip feeding' loot system to great effect, and with eight years worth of development time, Diablo III is set to claim Diablo II's title with some innovative gameplay changes.  Unlike Blizzard's recent Starcraft II, which changed so little about the game, Diablo III is really changing a lot.  Gone is the 'Potion Dependancy' of nearly all Hack 'n Slash titles, and in it's place a new focus on the WoW-esque 'Ability Bar', promising to deliver varied and interesting combat.

Is anyone else looking forward to the Diablo III?  What annoucements, if any, are you hoping to see arrive out of Blizzcon?

Unfortunately, it's difficult to talk about Diablo III without mentioning the shift in tone from the previous games, as the die-hard fans - and they are legion - are rather upset about it.  Instead of going into great detail, I'll simply show it in pictures:

Diablo II




Torchlight



Diablo III



Fan Reaction:

Note: The bottom of these two is the final art direction for Diablo III.

Thoughts?

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October 17, 2010 7:39:16 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting ,
Unlike Blizzard's recent Starcraft II, which changed so little about the game, Diablo III is really changing a lot.  Gone is the 'Potion Dependancy' of nearly all Hack 'n Slash titles, and in it's place a new focus on the WoW-esque 'Ability Bar', promising to deliver varied and interesting combat.

Is anyone else looking forward to the Diablo III?  What annoucements, if any, are you hoping to see arrive out of Blizzcon?

The shift away from potion dependancy will be really nice.

I would like to see a semi-solid release date (Qx 20xx is good).  I would like NOT to see any details about the 5th class - no need to show all the cards

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October 17, 2010 8:11:11 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I loved Diablo 1 (me playing it online actually forced my ISP to upgrade their servers, yes small town).  I really loved Diablo 2.  Diablo 3 has yet to make me care even a little bit.  To be fair part of my apathy is caused by "Hey we're making this game that will probably be released sometime before you die."  Maybe I'm not following it closely enough (really not following it much) but it all just seems like 'Diablo 2.5: Easy Mode'.

I really hope it's a good game.  I will probably get it.  But my expectations are low and my excitement is lower.

 

P.S. That change in art direction shown in your last image makes me cry.

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October 17, 2010 8:35:32 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Never played Diablo.  I might give 3 a try some day.  People seem to like them.

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October 17, 2010 8:37:52 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

While I am sad about the art direction, when I first played wow I really appreciated how they had made a cohesive graphical depiction of the world. Even if it looked like a cartoon, everything melded really well together. I think that's more important than what colour filter you use.

That being said, I still want gore-over-the-top hack-n-slash.

Diablo 3 remains my "most anticipated" title since WoW was originally released.

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October 17, 2010 8:45:02 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Until I actually play it, I'll reserve judgement.  That said, the monk trailer was absolutely disgusting; it looked like a bad anime-fanboy machinema...

 

Class-wise, I'm hoping for a "Knight in Shining Armour" for the fifth class.  The barbarian is nice and all, but the dual-weilding savage with spiked armour doesn't have the same appeal as a glistening knight in platemail with a trusty sword and shield.

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October 17, 2010 9:10:37 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Darvin3,
...Class-wise, I'm hoping for a "Knight in Shining Armour" for the fifth class.  The barbarian is nice and all, but the dual-weilding savage with spiked armour doesn't have the same appeal as a glistening knight in platemail with a trusty sword and shield.

The common belief is that we'll see a generic "Archer" class, as there isn't a class at current that is Bow-focused.  After the excitment-killing reveals of the "Wizard", "Witch Doctor" and "Monk" most people are expecting the class to simply be called "Archer".
Another belief, due to the changes so far, is that the final class will be a "Cleric" or "Priest" with a focus on Healing and Holy Magic.  This comes from the games shift in fighting mechanics; as the game now closely resembles World of Warcraft, a healing class fits into the Holy Trinity; Tank, DPS and Healer.

Quoting Dhraconus,
...Diablo 3 has yet to make me care even a little bit.  To be fair part of my apathy is caused by "Hey we're making this game that will probably be released sometime before you die."  Maybe I'm not following it closely enough (really not following it much) but it all just seems like 'Diablo 2.5: Easy Mode'...

The major features of Diablo III are as follows:

  • The main-world is static and no longer randomised; Dungeons are still randomly generated.
  • Five Classes, with only the Barbarian returning.  This was explained as "the Barbarian was the only class we thought we could improve".
  • Combat is now focused around abilities.  Demo-players have commented that the gameplay is similar to a sped-up version of World of Warcraft.
  • Players will have a multitude of customisation options centered around the Artisan; an upgradable NPC who can craft, imbue and alter weapons and Armour.
  • Classes now have class-specific 'Sets' that others cannot use; the best items in the game are all Set items.  Items also use the World of Warcraft "Soulbound" system, to prevent players from trading used Gear.
  • The game will feature 'End Game' content which will be accessable to players once they have reached the level cap of 60.  Little is known about this content.  It is speculated that this will be a set of Dungeons that contain the best Sets of Gear, mimicking World of Warcraft's progessions system.
  • The game has no Health or Mana potions.  Enemies now drop Health and Mana orbs, which regenerate a set amount of Health and Mana.  Demo-players have commented that this introduces "down time", as players wait for their Health and Mana to regenerate to a point before being able to continue in combat.
  • Dungeons now contain 'Boss Fights'.  Instead of simple click and potion spamming, Bosses have set behaviour pattens that need to be learnt and overcome to defeat the bosses.  This has been described as "similar to World of Warcrafts".
  • The game sees the return of the three difficulty level system from the previous games.
  • The game is designed so that at the end of the final difficulty level, players will have achieved the level cap and be elligible for 'End Game' content.
  • Battle.net 2.0 is seeing new features added to "meet the unique demands of Diablo III".  No additional information on these features has been released.
  • Diablo III has been described as the same size as Diablo II.
  • Diablo III will feature several areas, including Tristram, from the previous games.
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October 17, 2010 9:38:52 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

So they WoW-ed Diablo, toony graphics and all?  Somebody needs to fire the entire art department at Blizzard, especially after it did a similar art change with SC2.

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October 17, 2010 9:42:51 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

MiniWarcraft, YAY!

I happen to love Warcraft and Diablo 1 and 2 so yeah, biased.

 

Mainly because of coop, ts very high on my "awesome future" list.

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October 17, 2010 10:41:26 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

, Diablo II is still the best Hack 'n Slash money can buy.

have to disagree with you there. Titan Quest blows it out of the water with the much larger selection of classes and dual classing capabilities.  Was hoping Diablo III would follow suit but only getting 5 classes again.

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October 17, 2010 11:25:53 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting SwerydAss,

, Diablo II is still the best Hack 'n Slash money can buy.


have to disagree with you there. Titan Quest blows it out of the water with the much larger selection of classes and dual classing capabilities.  Was hoping Diablo III would follow suit but only getting 5 classes again.

It's all subjective, but titan quest never come close to being as addicting or fun to me as diablo 2 was. It was just somehow missing something.

I haven't found any other diablo clone that has ever come close to being as fun as diablo itself. I'm not entirely sure that I think Diablo 3 will live up to it's past either, I haven't heard anything about it that's really made me take notice either. But at the same time, it's a Blizzard game and they haven't disapointed me yet so I will definitely get it when it comes out.

As for wanting a definitive release date, good luck getting one from Blizzard.

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October 17, 2010 11:37:55 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

The common belief is that we'll see a generic "Archer" class

I'd agree, this is the most likely outcome.  Each Diablo so far has had a dedicated archer class, and none of the classes that have been introduced so far really have any business using a bow as anything other than an auxiliary weapon.

 

If I were to hazard a guess as to what the final class will be, I would suppose an Aragorn-inspired ranger that can quickly switch between a mobile ranged-attacker and a direct melee-attacker at will.  Priest would also make sense, though a dedicated healer is out of the cards.  Last I heard on the subject, Blizzard has stated that the game will be playable solo as any class, meaning a dedicated healer is a non-starter.  Now, I do think the concept of the Holy Warrior Cleric has been unfairly type-cast as a healer and other interpretations have not been thoroughly explored, so I do think it's entirely possible that we could see a priest or cleric with a very non-standard flavour.

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October 18, 2010 2:56:51 AM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

D3 I could probably get behind. RealID, Battle.net... bleh.

Art style, we'll see. I didn't like Borderland's art style at all, but when it dropped in price I picked it up and enjoyed it.

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October 18, 2010 3:24:31 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Darvin3,

The common belief is that we'll see a generic "Archer" class
I'd agree, this is the most likely outcome.  Each Diablo so far has had a dedicated archer class, and none of the classes that have been introduced so far really have any business using a bow as anything other than an auxiliary weapon.

 

If I were to hazard a guess as to what the final class will be, I would suppose an Aragorn-inspired ranger that can quickly switch between a mobile ranged-attacker and a direct melee-attacker at will.  Priest would also make sense, though a dedicated healer is out of the cards.  Last I heard on the subject, Blizzard has stated that the game will be playable solo as any class, meaning a dedicated healer is a non-starter.  Now, I do think the concept of the Holy Warrior Cleric has been unfairly type-cast as a healer and other interpretations have not been thoroughly explored, so I do think it's entirely possible that we could see a priest or cleric with a very non-standard flavour.

I suppose that depends on whose 'standard' you use for a Holy Warrior Cleric.  I agree in recent times, especially multiplayer games, clerics have become heal bots incapable of really killing anything.  But if you look back at the cleric from D&D through AD&D 2nd Ed. you'll find a class that could wear full plate armor, wield a nice big war hammer and a shield, smash skulls on the front line and still use buffs, debuffs, heals, and damage spells to great effect.  More recently there seems to be this need to differentiate clerics and paladins more 'clearly' and so clerics were demoted to squishy status.  Then most games aren't as complex or well developed as D&D (even the D&D video games are watered down for obvious reasons).

 

On another note the "just like WoW" aspects of D3 (mentioned above) make me think this sounds more like "Warcraft Mystery Dungeon" than Diablo 3.  But I will reserve judgment until it comes out.  I will say that if Diablo has become too much like WoW I will cry.

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October 18, 2010 4:49:37 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I'm looking forward to Blizzcon. Perhaps any good news will lessen my worries. But my concern is that D3 will be way too "wow-esque".

When I read about "salvaging" and found out there was "essence" and other raw materials shown in a video about the artisans feature I was tremendously pissed off. I can't think of it being fun and presenting another aspect than collecting new gear or tossing the magic cube.

I think the main reason that so many old school Diablo fans take offense at D3 is that most (design + gameplay) parts do already have the look and feel of WoW. Take a close look at the classes, the so often cited "colors", resource system and the globes. We'll see if those parts will be an evolution gameplay-wise. The third part should do Diablo I at least some justice.

I played Diablo I and II for ages and I have definitley no high hopes for part 3! I'm not sure if I'm looking forward to it.

So what can we expect from a hack n slay title developed in the fairway of World of Warcraft anyway? It must be wow-esque...

And btw... should I start the Activision debate anew...

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October 18, 2010 5:22:34 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting FadedC,

Quoting SwerydAss, reply 9
, Diablo II is still the best Hack 'n Slash money can buy.


have to disagree with you there. Titan Quest blows it out of the water with the much larger selection of classes and dual classing capabilities.  Was hoping Diablo III would follow suit but only getting 5 classes again.

It's all subjective, but titan quest never come close to being as addicting or fun to me as diablo 2 was. It was just somehow missing something.

I haven't found any other diablo clone that has ever come close to being as fun as diablo itself. I'm not entirely sure that I think Diablo 3 will live up to it's past either, I haven't heard anything about it that's really made me take notice either. But at the same time, it's a Blizzard game and they haven't disapointed me yet so I will definitely get it when it comes out.

As for wanting a definitive release date, good luck getting one from Blizzard.

 

True it is all subjective, but on the other hand Titan Quest's mod community is very good and the Underlord mod in my opinion is the best example of the genre.  I agree that the original version of TQ was only ok, the Underlord mod added that something special.  If you own Titan Quest i highly recommend getting that mod and trying it once more.  It is a much more detailed game, with tons of added content.

 

I tried playing D2 recently, and it just felt so limited in comparison to Underlord in regards to re-playability, complexity, graphics, and interconnectivity that I had no desire to play for more than a short while.  The original game had a moderate amount of interdependence between each individual class choice, but the way your two choices mesh and how you work them together to create a character within Underlord just brings an element that Diablo won't ever have from the current state it sounds like.  Don't get me wrong I'll still most likely buy Diablo 3, but it has a lot to live up to.

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October 18, 2010 6:26:32 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Titan quest was really good... we tested it on a LAN, and we ended up playing nothing else. An excellent multiplayer game.

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October 18, 2010 6:33:18 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

It's a hilarious thought that a game would "get deeper" by stealing ideas from WOW (which is the definition of casual) but in this case, it may actually make sense. =P
D2 really was a simple Hack&Slash affair where you could hardly do anything in a wrong way.

I'm not so sure if the "potion nerf" is a good thing. In the more recent Diablo clones, red/blue pots typically worked as a heal over time so once you had it going, that was checked off.
Your ability to keep your potions organised so you would not run out of easily accessible ones (on your belt) in the middle of the fight did no longer matter so it did in fact dumb the game down.

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October 18, 2010 7:59:40 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I'm not worried about the quality because Blizzard always manages to deliver a good game. But I'm not that excited either, because Blizzard always takes forever to do it. When they have a date set, then I'll start paying closer attention.

 

In the mean time, at least listening to people whine that Diablo 3 has a color palate that includes something other then 40 shades of "dark" is pretty amusing.

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October 18, 2010 9:14:19 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I had the opportunity to play about 15 minutes worth of Diablo 3 at PAX 09 with the Monk class.. while undoubtedly many changes have been made since, it most definitely felt like a Diablo game, not a sped up World of Warcraft game. It also was not "cartoony" as such, definitely not comparable to Torchlight. It looked like a prettied up high resolution Diablo 2. It was a desert level, not a dungeon crawl, so I can't comment much on lighting.

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October 18, 2010 9:40:10 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I am VERY excited for Diablo III!

 

The melee classes with their abilities look so fun to play. In Diablo II with the Barbarian if you choose WhirlWhind it's WW until you win. The skills they got in their site for the Barbarian seems really cool.

 

Also like the ditching of the town portal system. Was abusive. Easy way out....

 

The health and mana system I'm definetly behind!

 

The replacement for mana for the non-magic classes seems great as well!

 

The itemsystem with soulbounding is a FINALLY!                  Gathering stuff as resources to upgrade your stuff sounds cool as well.

 

I really can't find any faults with the game.

 

 

...and think that I haven't finished Diablo II LoD in Hell mode yet....

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October 18, 2010 10:32:36 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Oh, and relating to the OP, Blizzard has put in better RealID controls. You can disable it entirely so you wouldn't even get RealID requests, turn off Friends of Friends so you could have RealID friends, but their friends won't see you, or just have everything on. I think the RealID-on-forums fiasco wisened them up a bit.

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October 18, 2010 10:47:13 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I'll reserve judgment on the gameplay until I actually try it, but I'm not not paying a dime until I hear what future plans Activision has for the game.  If they're going to have regular DLC infusions for new areas, classes, hats, etc. then no deal.

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October 18, 2010 11:55:04 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

- They have confirmed that while some characters do have co-op friendly skills, "if you're not doing damage, you're doing something wrong" was mentioned on the twitter feed.  There won't be a dedicated healer - at least not by design.

- There was a lot of fear about the art direction, but they've had a lot of time with it since then, and that was also just the first act.  I suspect it will be dark and gritty torwards the end of the game.

- The salvaging system has me worried.  I really liked how in Diablo 2, before LOD, the best items were "rare" - meaning they had randomly generated stats,and thus they were unique.  Once they made the top level "unique" items, the best items were always the best, and there wasn't a chance to improve on them.  Everyone had the same stuff.  I'm worried that with people being able to salvage items and craft better ones, it will be more about just plain grinding for supplies instead of grinding for cool items.


- These guys have a lot of resources at their disposal.  The game might not be the diablo 3 you or I envisioned, but it will still be a great game.

- I'm really interested to find out who the first mini boss is - they are always memorable.  The Butcher from Diablo 1, Blood Raven from Diablo 2...who's next?

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October 18, 2010 12:03:05 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Seems a bit of a stretch to say that boss fights requiring unique and adaptive strategies makes the game like World of Warcraft. That should really be true of any game that has boss monsters.

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October 18, 2010 12:52:23 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting FutileEmotion,
- I'm really interested to find out who the first mini boss is - they are always memorable.  The Butcher from Diablo 1, Blood Raven from Diablo 2...who's next?

If the boss does his job - you are! =P

And the fact of having boss fights doesn't make the game "like WOW". Much less like a real MMO. =P

It's that they are supposed to be heavily scripted events so when it's between 90 and 70 % health you have to be hopping on one foot to do any damage.
At each 10 % after that an add spawns which can only be defeated if you kick the old tree with the bee's nest in it so the bees descend on the add and distract it.
If you fail to kill the adds quickly enough, they split in two and if you don't keep their health levels between 15 % while killing both, they immediately heal to full.
The more absurd the hoops you have to jump through, the more l33t the encounter.

The downside? Eventually a happy-go-lucky slasher game turns into work and requires internet research for the one-and-only way to beat the encounter.

I don't mind a game requiring some thinking but the danger with going overboard with the scripting is that you cannot use your character's special skills any more to find new and interesting ways to beat an encounter.

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