R.I.P Newzbin , closed over Legal Action...a Resource Lost...

Man...this is complete SHIT!!!

By on May 18, 2010 5:12:55 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

RavenX

Join Date 10/2008
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Newzbin has arguably been the "Best" source and index listing of what is posted to BBS Newsgroups around the world. BBS stands for Bulletin Board System and almost every Internet Provider in the entire world provides access to them as part of your Internet package. Whether you're old enough to remember or not, BBS's are the Foundation of the Internet. These are the Original Internet. In many ways this is what the Internet was built on. If you had to compare it to something physical, use this example. You buy some land and build a house. That land is the Earth, your foundation. That land, that Earth, is the BBS system of Newsgroups. It's what the Internet was built on. Think of every website in existence as a "House", sitting on the land. Without getting extremely technical that's the best analogy I can give. It is a flawed analogy, it's not exactly accurate, but it's close enough.

I've been a free member and user of Newzbin for well over the last ten years (No, it's not just for pirates and hackers). in a way you could also compare BBS Newsgroups to MIRC back in the day before ICQ and Yahoo Instant Messenger and Skype. Think of Newzbin as a site that would tell you what everyone was talking about in various channels on MIRC. That's what Newzbin was. You had to either be a paid member of the site or you had to be INVITED by a paid member and were given a basic free membership. It wasn't always "Invite Only", but when they switched to that system everyone had to make new accounts and if you weren't already paid or re-invited you were locked out, sorry about your bad luck. Luckily, as I was a free member, a friend (who was just a random Internet stranger at the time) re-invited me and I was allowed back in.

Some people, namely those who used Newzbin's service, are going to greatly suffer because of this. It was an invaluable tool to help people find needed information quickly and easily. Any information at all from examples such as "Legal Statutes from cases dating back to the Early 19th Century" to "Online Legal Copies of Every Book in the Library of Congress" to "Discussions being held by College Physics Professors" and also "Doctors Sharing Research Up-To-The-Minute". It was as much a listing of communications as these very same forums are. BBS Newsgroups are nothing more then that. People talking back and forth in topics just like this. The exception is back then our ability to post and reply wasn't set up like this, so every post made, whether it be a new topic or a reply to that topic where it's own "Thread". Newzbin helped organize those threads and posts and show you where things were so you could quickly find them.

Sadly how-ever, as with many technological innovations in our day, some people chose to use these for evil purposes. Even though these "Newsgroups" are intended for communication, and to provide a backbone for the rest of the Internet, they are also used to host and share files with limited "retention". Every ISP on the GLOBE must have space on the BBS Newsgroups for their systems to work. I don't know why or how it's set up exactly, I don't work for the cable company so I can't tell you why they even have to be there at all, but they do. More and more ISP's these days Are Limiting or Flat Out DENYING their customers access to these Newsgroups. If your ISP isn't giving you access to them, you're not getting everything you're paying for and you should call them and DEMAND Access as a Paying Customer. Far be it from me to tell you what to do, it's no skin off my shoulder if you enjoy wasting your money, but I know I don't like wasting mine.

When I say some people use Newsgroups and by default the listings on Newzbin for "Evil" I mean piracy of course. Newsgroups go by the more common term Usenet. Still, Newzbin as a website did NOT HOST OR SHARE ANY FILES. All it did was tell people where files were at, in what groups they were listed, and what the file names were. It did this because technically these posts on various Newsgroups were the same as the other topics or "threads" or "conversations", it just so happens some of them are pieces, usually .rar's, of games or movies. The same kinds of things that can be found on any Torrent site.

Newzbin did nothing wrong. People did have LEGITIMATE USES for it, just like they do Fogbugs, or Photobucket, or many other sites. Newzbin was closed because they owe money to people I believe. I didn't know anything about any of this or it's legal trouble before finding THIS ARTICLE when I tried to log-on to Newzbin today.

If you know or heard anything about this or find a site that talks a little more in depth, please let me know as I'd like to find out all I can about it being shut down.

Hopefully some of you out there see this for what it is regardless of what the causes are. Another place being closed because someone thinks they're losing money over piracy and pressured some Government to take action. Newzbin wasn't just a site for pirates or other thieves. It had real value. Eventually, slowing, this is going to turn into a legal and virtual "Witch-hunt" by Governments to shut down more and more sites limiting knowledge and people's freedoms Online.

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LuthienStarshine
May 18, 2010 7:19:31 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Still, Newzbin as a website did NOT HOST OR SHARE ANY FILES. All it did was tell people where files were at, in what groups they were listed, and what the file names were.

That's it in a nut-shell.

Tough.

Aiding and abetting the abuse of IP.

Just a quick note....incitement to terrorism is no different to piloting one of the planes in 9/11 .... whether you just convince a bomber to blow himself up [and others] by showing him 'how' or you strap it on yourself.....either way you 'will' be dead.

"Ooh...I don't actually HAVE the warez myself....but here's where you can get it......"

Accessory before the fact.

 

 

And yes...I'm SURE there's legitimate [legal] users of Torrents too...however I am yet to see one in a Google search....

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May 18, 2010 8:06:44 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

People talk about hacking and cracking over Teamspeak - Shut it down

People use the telephone for illegal activities - shut it down

People host copywrite content on a hosting service - shut them down

Guns are used in crime - get rid of all the guns

Mcdonalds causes heart desease - Shut them down

And oh YA 

BLAME 9-11

 

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May 18, 2010 10:11:41 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

People talk about hacking and cracking over Teamspeak - Shut it down

People use the telephone for illegal activities - shut it down

People host copywrite content on a hosting service - shut them down

Guns are used in crime - get rid of all the guns

Mcdonalds causes heart desease - Shut them down

And your point is......

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May 18, 2010 10:25:24 PM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

[quote who="Jafo" reply="3" id="2622930"]
And your point is......
[/quote]

Communication isn't something you should police 100% of the time just because sometimes when people talk or read or listen they say or see or hear things you think they shouldn't.

Since you want throw out terrorism for example, let me direct to you a number of murderous dictatorships that use as a backing to their power the control of communication.

Jafo, try looking up STO. It's a pos game, but when they released the client for OB. They released a torrent that offered 10x+ faster downloads than their own download method.

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May 18, 2010 10:41:58 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Jafo,

And yes...I'm SURE there's legitimate [legal] users of Torrents too...however I am yet to see one in a Google search....

A Anti-Piracy Movie came out a while back called "Steal This Film". The makers of this film Against Piracy had a Non-For-Profit Deal with ThePirateBay to Distribute this film. For the first 6 months (or was it a year?) the ONLY WAY to get this movie was to download it with a Torrent program. You can find relevant information with this link for the Google search I did...

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&q=piracy+movie+distributed+through+torrents+Steal+This+Film&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&fp=ca804df6b427d280

There ya go, Jafo. A %100 Legal use of a Torrent. A movie made and distributed ON PURPOSE with Torrents...against Piracy. I also talk about it in this thread Here I made a while back.

Granted, I'll have to agree that's probably the only time a Torrent has ever been used to pass something around that wasn't pirated illegally. Also take note though, the movie "Steal This Film" had over 1 Million downloads within the first week of release. If Hollywood movie makers made and distributed movies this way I'll bet they would find they could cut out the whole "movie going experience" and still make just as much money, if not more money, then the way movies are made and released now. At least when it came to distribution anyway

On a more personal note, Jafo (and please don't take this the wrong way), but when-ever any kind of subject like this is broached on the forums you appear to have a rather large chip on your shoulder. Again, please don't take this the wrong way. I don't think your reaction or attitude with it is bad in any way. I've been there and know what it's like not wanting your work stolen and passed around for free. When I was a Origin Employee though I got bitched at by my boss more then once for making comments with my forum Mod account that I should have made with my player account. (He said it looked bad for me to express my personal views with what was essentially a company account)

Was one of your family members gunned down in a dark ally by a Torrent wielding maniac or something? You could always go the "Vigilante" route. Maybe we can call you Bat-Jafo!!! Or Jafo-Man!!! Foul Internet pirates beware...the Dark Knight Jafo, slayer of file sharers shall get you. J/K

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May 19, 2010 12:16:35 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

On a more personal note, Jafo (and please don't take this the wrong way), but when-ever any kind of subject like this is broached on the forums you appear to have a rather large chip on your shoulder.

This thread appears on Wincustomize.com .... a site which LEGALLY hosts artists' work [IP].

Much of my time is spent either hunting down people who 'pirate' our members' works...or help members 'hunt them down'.  I don't do it for fun....and it's not a 'chip on my shoulder' thing....simply plain disgust that such efforts are needed because there are ignorant children out there hell-bent on violating our members' IP rights.

Too often people presume it is a 'chip'...or an attitude thing...or even an abuse of the site's Admin privileges....but it isn't.

WHEN one's own copyright/IP is violated you tend to think "Fuck...some prick/brat has pinched what was MY OWN WORK....bastard!".  Then you appreciate what it is to the Film maker/whatever whose IP is distributed without consent/payment, etc.

What I DO like is when people end up [as one Nintendo thief did] with a Judgement for 1.6 Million ....something that will permanently screw up his life ... for the rest of it.  Not bad for a 22 year-old.

Re Torrents....that 'steal this film' thingie was an 'educator'....but I'm sure there are 'several' legit uses/users of Torrents....but the VAST majority will be stolen IP.

Getting philosophical about the pros and cons of torrents/piracy is all well and good in the academic world....mass-debates and all...but in the REAL, COMMERCIAL world we all end up living in.....AFTER we leave school....IP theft/piracy/copyright issues are all actual problems...with actual criminality and consequence.

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May 19, 2010 2:08:20 AM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

I live in the real commercial world, finished school. I don't like having my work taken for free anymore than you do. The difference is, even though I hate not getting paid, I don't think the hospital I worked out should run a credit check everytime someone came in with a severed limb and expected treatment. Sometimes, you just have to accept that you won't get paid, go after those you can. It certainly doesn't strengthen your point to run around screaming 911 and who cares if we take down certain methods of tech so you can sleep better at night. Anyone who works for living, loses money for one reason or another that isn't "fair."

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May 19, 2010 3:26:10 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Jafo,

On a more personal note, Jafo (and please don't take this the wrong way), but when-ever any kind of subject like this is broached on the forums you appear to have a rather large chip on your shoulder.


This thread appears on Wincustomize.com .... a site which LEGALLY hosts artists' work [IP].

Much of my time is spent either hunting down people who 'pirate' our members' works...or help members 'hunt them down'.  I don't do it for fun....and it's not a 'chip on my shoulder' thing....simply plain disgust that such efforts are needed because there are ignorant children out there hell-bent on violating our members' IP rights.

Too often people presume it is a 'chip'...or an attitude thing...or even an abuse of the site's Admin privileges....but it isn't.

WHEN one's own copyright/IP is violated you tend to think "Fuck...some prick/brat has pinched what was MY OWN WORK....bastard!".  Then you appreciate what it is to the Film maker/whatever whose IP is distributed without consent/payment, etc.

What I DO like is when people end up [as one Nintendo thief did] with a Judgment for 1.6 Million ....something that will permanently screw up his life ... for the rest of it.  Not bad for a 22 year-old.

Re Torrents....that 'steal this film' thingie was an 'educator'....but I'm sure there are 'several' legit uses/users of Torrents....but the VAST majority will be stolen IP.

Getting philosophical about the pros and cons of torrents/piracy is all well and good in the academic world....mass-debates and all...but in the REAL, COMMERCIAL world we all end up living in.....AFTER we leave school....IP theft/piracy/copyright issues are all actual problems...with actual criminality and consequence.

Ahh, yes indeed. I wasn't aware that's what you did. That does make a lot more sense to me now. That is impressive for only 22 . Just remember, with great power comes....better looking prostitutes escorts...er um...great responsibility. Yes, responsibility, that's it.

I never had to worry about my work being stolen during my time in the industry as it was for a on-line game. Unless you could hack your way in (and believe me people tried) you couldn't see my work unless you paid to play. Any UO player from an OSI shard who played a Necromancer when we implemented them can tell you about some of the Necro-Specific spell components they needed and the Quests they had to go through to get them. I did some of those, and many other small things, aside from just plan events and answer player pages in game. Free shards that emulated our official servers had to make up their own Necromancers and other classes as they didn't have nearly the same client , or any features really, that we did in house. So I didn't have to worry about them stealing my work either. They made their own.

Knowing what it is you do though, I feel I understand your position much better. I hope you didn't take offense at how I said my earlier post, I didn't mean it to sound like that.

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May 19, 2010 6:37:51 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Lets not forget that when a Palandin of the Light genocides the undead, he might seem like he has "grudge".

Also there is definately a difference between standing on a street corner preaching the word of your gospel and mudering the innocents to use their blood to open the hellgate beneath your stronghold.

I dislike the idea of culling the local villages because they all *might* be unbelivers because *some* of them are.

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May 19, 2010 9:24:24 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

WHEN one's own copyright/IP is violated you tend to think "Fuck...some prick/brat has pinched what was MY OWN WORK....bastard!".  Then you appreciate what it is to the Film maker/whatever whose IP is distributed without consent/payment, etc

 

 

i agree jafo. although i am not skinning savvy i am a musician and have been for 30 years. i never wanted stardom or any of the superficial glam crap that goes with big music inductry contracts. me and my best mate merely wrote songs and scores, recorded them and sold cassettes and then cd's, and played live where we could merely for the pleasure of bringing pleasure to others. although it all ended in 2000 when my friend commited suicide during his marriage break up, i still consider the work we did as private and not for others to benefit from financially. i think all skinners will relate to me when i say that our work, whether it be a song/score or an icon pack or wallpaper, are our "babies". we conceived them and we gave birth to them, they are part of us. if scumbags stole my work in order to make a quick buck from it i also would come down on them like a ton of bricks.

well done jafo for your hard work and dedication in tracking down these thief low lifes. i certainly understand why you are so dedicated to protecting peoples hard work and creations, and may you always be successful in rooting the bastards out.

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May 19, 2010 9:38:08 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting myfist0,
People talk about hacking and cracking over Teamspeak - Shut it down

People use the telephone for illegal activities - shut it down

People host copywrite content on a hosting service - shut them down

Guns are used in crime - get rid of all the guns

Mcdonalds causes heart desease - Shut them down

And oh YA 

BLAME 9-11

 

Tsk tsk tsk.

The problems must be tackled at its roots:

Some humans do evil/selfish things - Exterminate all humans.

 

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May 19, 2010 9:47:10 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

i wonder how many user on this thread who are advocating the download and use of illegal copyrighted materail have actually been burgled or mugged? its tantamount to the same thing. the only difference is when you break into someones home and trash the place looking for the dosh you need to visit that seedy little whore house or buy yourself the next fix of whatever it is you're addicted to and can't live without, you see the damage and destruction you leave behind that is going to cause immense heartbreak and anxiety to the home owner. with illegal file sharing you don't actually "see" the damage caused...................so i guess that makes it all ok to do? 

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May 19, 2010 10:46:31 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting supershaft,
i wonder how many user on this thread who are advocating the download and use of illegal copyrighted materail have actually been burgled or mugged? its tantamount to the same thing. the only difference is when you break into someones home and trash the place looking for the dosh you need to visit that seedy little whore house or buy yourself the next fix of whatever it is you're addicted to and can't live without, you see the damage and destruction you leave behind that is going to cause immense heartbreak and anxiety to the home owner. with illegal file sharing you don't actually "see" the damage caused...................so i guess that makes it all ok to do? 

 

1) Who here is advocating copyright infringement?

2) I have been burgalrated. It sucks. I lost some stuff I liked.

3) They don't see the damage because its invisable. If only 1 person ever infringed copyright no one would EVER notice. Copying a song (bigger the item bigger the footprint but as an example) is like takeing a leaf of grass out of someones garden. It will take thousands of people before anyone even notices, and kids do that kind of crap with peoples gardens every day. You expect them to not do that with technology aswell?

4) No that dosn't make it right. That also dosn't mean you should oppress innocents to try and stop those that do not conform to the standard.

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May 19, 2010 10:55:13 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

i think you are missing my point aractain...................stealing is morally wrong..............PERIOD

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May 19, 2010 11:24:27 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

That also dosn't mean you should oppress innocents to try and stop those that do not conform to the standard.

One way or another we are ALL victims of crime.

You don't have to be burgled to still need to purchase/use locks, etc. on your property.  If there were no crime the only people to 'suffer' would be locksmiths.....

....and Police....

...and Lawyers....

....Judges....

OK...so lots would still 'suffer'.

It's a healthy 'business' is crime....a growth industry....guaranteed employment....

...like Undertakers....

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May 19, 2010 11:34:36 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

So... I gues you all hate robin hood then hu?

 

Hehe... j/k  I am trolling...

 

 

The End.

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May 19, 2010 2:45:27 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

How about the IP of seeds for food.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi1FTCzDSck&feature=fvw

Here is an excerpt from "The Corporation" documentary. The so called 'news' and reporting is being controlled. Once the internet has no more sharing services, wait and see what you will allowed to be exposed to.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZkDikRLQrw

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May 19, 2010 3:31:36 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

In my country, Spain, after the modification of the Law of Intellectual Property (Ley 23/2006) it is legal to make copies of literary, artistic or scientific works without authorization from the intellectual property holders under the following conditions :

  • Made for private use.
  • Not used for profit. Not for collective use.
  • The work has already been published.
  • The work has been accessed legally.
  • Private copy right does not apply to software.

Furthermore. A tax is applied to most writtable media and given to several authors' societies which are in charge of distributing it among authors. SGAE being in charge of most of it.

There have already been several trials against spanish eMule and direct downlad webpages which offer links to comercial films, music and books where the web administrators have been found innocent. So it's quite clear that it is legal to download from peer to peer programs for private use despite SGAE efforts. There's been no trial about usenet groups as far as I know but seeing other cases it seems likely it would go the same way.

I have certainly downloaded plenty of films using peer to peer software. Films I have paid for when I paid for writtable dvds, phone memory cards or hard disk. I still go to cinema, more or less same as before I had ADSL. Only difference is that I almost no longer watch TV. So I now pay less in publicity watched and more in taxes for writtable media.

Am I a stealer?

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May 19, 2010 4:11:07 PM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

Quoting Jafo,

That also dosn't mean you should oppress innocents to try and stop those that do not conform to the standard.


One way or another we are ALL victims of crime.

You don't have to be burgled to still need to purchase/use locks, etc. on your property.  If there were no crime the only people to 'suffer' would be locksmiths.....

....and Police....

...and Lawyers....

....Judges....

OK...so lots would still 'suffer'.

It's a healthy 'business' is crime....a growth industry....guaranteed employment....

...like Undertakers....

No what you are advocating is more akin to strip searching every B&M retail customers to avoid theft. You take measures to prevent theft, but there is such a thing as too much.

Actually, I guess it would be more akin to just bulldozing the store to prevent the theft, but hey each idea is pretty... overboard.

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May 19, 2010 5:51:30 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

No what you are advocating is more akin to strip searching every B&M retail customers to avoid theft. You take measures to prevent theft, but there is such a thing as too much.

Actually, I guess it would be more akin to just bulldozing the store to prevent the theft, but hey each idea is pretty... overboard.

I compare this more to a bar than a store. As long as everyone there is of age, there aren't any problems. If only a few kids start drinking there, you can crack down on individuals - but once a heavy majority of the bar's partons are kids, it becomes simpler to shut down the bar, even at the expense of legitimate customers.

Usually things like this are self-policed. Imageshack, youtube, etc at least make an effort to remove illegal material when it is brought to their attention. Newzbin apparently was willing to throw up their hands and say "the users are doing it, not our fault" - and now are all butthurt that someone closed the bar.

Am I a stealer?

Under US laws, probably. Under your own laws? No - but don't be surprised when a lot of material is not available in your location.

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May 19, 2010 6:28:10 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting supershaft,
i think you are missing my point aractain...................stealing is morally wrong..............PERIOD

Last I checked no-one in this thread is advocating stealing....PERIOD.

Newzbin, (which it turns out this thread is about) has plenty of Legal and Legitimate uses. Out of all the information sharing sites and services, including the harmless ones like Photobucket, Fogbugs, Hulu, FilePlanet, to the damaging ones like ThePirateBay, uTorrent, Warez, etc etc...none of them, I repeat None Of Them, could boast that they had Doctors and Lawyers, and College Professors, having talks on them using their service...DAILY. I don't know any other service or web page that would list things like that, possibly Life Saving Information (if you're one of those Doctors talking), like Newzbin did. Newzbin wasn't a file sharing service. They didn't upload or download anything at all. All they did was list what is posted to "alt.binaries" Newsgroups. They listed EVERYTHING, including the pirated material Other People would post to various groups.

If you were a user like me, any user, had control and could filter what groups they saw listed and what groups they keep track of. I used them for investing and keeping track of stock information. Mostly because unlike with CNN and CNBC and other sites, with Newzbin I could filter my searches to just the stocks and topics limited to the companies I have stock in. An example would be "alt.binnaries.Penzoil".

Now if some-one were to use those listings to know where stolen goods were...well, that sounds more like a job for the Police if you ask me. Go after the thieves. Track them. It's not impossible or unwarranted. Hell, Metallica sued the parents of a 12 Year Old Girl. That's no BS, that's a fact. The cops raided her house and walked out with her parents computer in hand. When they found out it was the daughter and not the parents that installed IMesh and downloaded the MP3's...Metallica sued anyway, and won. THAT should be the example that is used to clamp down on Internet crime. NOT Censoring the Internet and shutting down sites that do as much good as they do bad.

In my humble opinion it is CENSORSHIP in it's finest form. Granted this particular case the site was shut down for financial reasons. Still, It's starting with other sites like this and who knows where it will slowly snowball too in a few more years. China and Australia are ALREADY Setting Fine Examples of what a Government Controlled Internet is like. Is that what you want? Is that what ANYONE wants? To be force-fed propaganda and told what to eat and drink and wear and act like? That's what the Internet will turn into eventually. Just as many of our Physical Freedoms have been limited, soon all our Virtual Freedoms will be just as limited...and much more easily...Monitored. That no "Big Brother Conspiracy Theory BS" either, that's cold-hard-Fact.

EDIT NOTE: I could be wrong on the age of the girl Metallica sued. It might have been around 14. Point is, the Fact is, they sued and Won.

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May 19, 2010 7:11:30 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting WIllythemailboy,

Am I a stealer?
Under US laws, probably. Under your own laws? No - but don't be surprised when a lot of material is not available in your location.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by "Under US laws, probably". I am not under US laws. It's like saying submarine zebras probably prefer cold pastures.

 

I have to agree with Raven X. To defend the eradication of Usenet is to defend censorship.

Usenet is not a distribution system used mainly for illegal purpouses with the excuse of some minimal legal use. Usenet started in an age with IP infringement being pretty much non existant in it.

Even this days IP infringement is only a small minority of Usenet's usage if you go by posts numbers.

If you go by transfer of bits usage the situation reverses. But this is only a reason for considering the discontinuation of binaries groups. Not that I would agree with indiscriminate eradication of binaries groups but at least there is some rational reasoning behind it.

There is no honest reason for advocating the dismissal of Usenet including text groups. Anyone promoting it should feel ashamed.

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May 19, 2010 7:13:03 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

THAT should be the example that is used to clamp down on Internet crime. NOT Censoring the Internet and shutting down sites that do as much good as they do bad.

Filing suit against 10% of the general public is not a practical solution. Not to mention the PR fallout that the group, as well as the RIAA and others, have suffered for pursuing that course. People don't like seeing 12 year old girls being sued. They don't object nearly as much when people profitting from piracy getting sued - and Newzbin was a for-profit company.

Besides, you're vastly overstating the legitimate uses of this service. From this:

Newzbin was also criticized for its “delisting” or notice and takedown procedures, which were referred to as a “cosmetic” and “cumbersome” mechanism designed to “render it impractical” for rights holders to have material removed.

Justice Kitchin went on to reject Newzbin’s assertion that an insignificant amount of links in their database relate to infringing content. Around 50,000 reports (.NZBs) were checked and around 97% had a valid link to IMDb (TF: Kitchin apparently assumes that everything on IMDB is not free to share), 0.7% to Amazon and a further 1.5% were otherwise shown to be commercially available. Only 0.3% were not shown to be commercially available, evidence which the court found “extremely powerful”.

When 90+% of your content is links to copyrighted material, with the intent for others to download it, you are a pirate site. Any other uses are simply smoke to use to obscure your true purpose.

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May 19, 2010 7:20:28 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

I have to agree with Raven X. To defend the eradication of Usenet is to defend censorship.

See previous post. To defend Newzbin is to knowingly and intentionally defend and encourage piracy. Guess what, if you lose the copyrighted material, most of their users won't pay for it. Their business model depends on the piracy part of the site.

By all means, separate the filesharing from the text groups. I doubt the text groups would have enough paying members to keep the site afloat, though. That the site folded seems to indicate that the owners agree with my assessment.

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May 19, 2010 8:17:27 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I'm not defending the comercial viability of Newzbin but the moral and legal right to provide a communication channel. Like the one provided by Newzbin and other Usenet carriers.

If a million users post 1KiB legal messages and a thousand users post 9MiB messages containing copyrighted material then, yes, 90% of content, as measured by storage of bits, would be copyrighted material. But it's just 1% of users doing copyright infringement while the large majority is doing perfectly legal communication activities.

My numbers are made up but Usenet is like this. The largest ammount of posts, and thus users, are text only and not infringing copyright. Only a minority are doing copyright infringement even if they use, and abuse, the majority of storage. This minority is even despissed by many Usenet users since retention for legal binaries would be better if copyright infringers were not abusing Usenet.

Get rid of that minority which infringe copyright in Usenet and most users will aplaud you. Get rid of the whole of Usenet and we'll scorn you.

Also. If "To defend Newzbin is to knowingly and intentionally defend and encourage piracy." Then, by the same reasoning, to defend Internet Service Providers would also be to knowingly and intentionally defend and encourage piracy, wouldn't it? Impulse's profit is going to suffer quite a hit if Internet Service Providers are shut down to prevent piracy.

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