Fierce Creatures

By on April 19, 2010 9:15:19 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums


Join Date 08/2009

No, I’m not referring to the lacklustre 1997 movie (‘Not a sequel an equal’ my ass!) but rather the non-magical/enchanted/corrupted creatures that have counterparts in the Real World.

Okay, ‘mundane’ creatures aren’t as sexy or fantastic as vampire uber-bears or flying zombie wolves but they do lend a more down-to-earth (down-to-elemental?) charm that doesn’t throw magical creatures at you from the get go. Don’t get me wrong, I want fantasy creatures but I don’t want just fantasy creatures from the get go.


Seems to indicate some mundane creatures but what the hell I want to make a thread about it.



Bears are good example of a potential foe for early game. Although responsible for only 10-15 fatalities a year in real life, one can imagine that humans competing in the post-cataclysm world for shelter and food may lead to far more fraught man-bear relations than seen in an episode of Yogi Bear.  Cave Bears, Black, Brown and Polar bears spring to mind as variations/levels of threat.


More importantly, with few troops in the early stages a pack of bears would prove rather dangerous, especially if you’re on a quest to steal some porridge. This in mind, having bears as units that are placed at the start of the game would demonstrate just how dangerous the world is, and how even mundane creatures can threaten your existence. As you advance, armies of well-equipped troops would not find bears that tough so perhaps a logical course of action would be to have them placed at a game start but not recurring- once all the bears are gone they don’t come back. Ever.


Guy on left- ‘You take the big one; I’ll take the little one’

Guy on right- ‘But you have a spear!’

Guy on left- ‘There’s always some excuse, isn’t there?’



Okay, I appreciate Elemental might not have much room for these guys unless you’re launching an attack through three feet of water using blood-based war paint but they serve to illustrate the point- if you were swimming in known shark territory and you saw a fin would you care if it was a cursed dire shark or a mundane Great White? Either way, the water would turn yellowy-brown in short order. ‘Case you were wondering, they cause about 100 fatalities a year.


Wolves get a bad rap. This is partly due to Hollywood horror movies and partly due to the fact they deserved their bad rap up until fairly recent times. Although rabies accounted for much of the attacks on humans, starving wolves were enough to create a truce between Russia and Germany during WW1 whilst they were beaten off. Packs of starving Wolves would be similar to packs of Bears- paced on the map at the beginning but unable to reappear.

Living in endless flat tundra can lead to very tiresome games of Hide-and-Seek.


Despite being rather comical and looking like my Aunt Catherine, Hippos are real jerks. Known for attacking people who so much as sneeze in a way that causes their displeasure, they kill more people a year than sharks and bears combined.

Unfortunately, they look hilarious, and if ‘You are attacked by a pack of Hippos!’ came up in a game you may fall off your chair laughing.


‘Ol Elephants have been used in warfare for millennia due to their trampling/goring combo. Having them as neutral creatures might be getting into hippo territory but as Empires seem to have that eastern thing perhaps a trainable unit a la Rome: Total War might be a possibility.

Three hours of trawling the internet and this is the best picture of an Elephant I could get.


See Elephants, minus the use in warfare.




Okay crocs and alligators might need a bit of an up-sizing to make them more threatening but I suppose we could assume they’re Sarcosuchus/Deinosuchus-like reptiles or just, you know, fatter than RL ones. Crocs are responsible for 600+ fatalities a year. Being ambush predators, having them invisible on the cloth map until to step on them in swamplands could be interesting.

Think you have the worst job in the world? DO YOU DO IT WAVING LIKE THIS GUY?!?


Yeah okay these guys need up-sizing too, perhaps as Titanoboa-like creatures (45ft long and weighing 1.2 tons). Giant Cobras would be awesome, too.

Pity they’re so small as they are responsible for tens of thousands of deaths every year.

Pictured- Titanoboa. Not Pictured- 30 school kids that had been poking it with sticks.


A Clash of the Titans favourite, the scorpion is in many ways an ideal enemy, being possessed of tough armour, claws, and a poison-inflicting tail. The South African spitting scorpion can spray poison over 1 metre, because, you know, sometimes pincers and poisonous barbs simply aren’t hardcore enough. Again, grounding in reality-good, The Rock as a half-scorpion chasing Brendon Fraser- bad.

It’s a little-known fact a dance-off is the only way to defeat a Giant Scorpion.

Also- Big Cats (Mountain Lions etc)


          Giant Spiders (see Giant Spider thread)

Mundane creatures can be interesting, as can those that simply enlarge commonly known creatures. In the beginning of Age of Empires the biggest threat was Lions, Elephants, Crocs etc, as they had no fear of humans. Given Elemental taking place a hundred years after the cataclysm, perhaps mundane creatures can prove a true danger to the survival of your people.

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Publius of NV
April 20, 2010 6:58:25 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Among the mounts I would like to see in the game ...

Definitely Horses, Wargs, and Elephants ...

Hopefully Rhinos, Armadillos, Griffons, and Eagles ...

and Flying Insects + Wyverns + Drakes would be really really cool, yet unlikely (still hope they are in, at least for fallen).

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April 20, 2010 7:12:43 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Tasunke,
Among the mounts I would like to see in the game ...

Definitely Horses, Wargs, and Elephants ...

Hopefully Rhinos, Armadillos, Griffons, and Eagles ...

and Flying Insects + Wyverns + Drakes would be really really cool, yet unlikely (still hope they are in, at least for fallen).

I'd be interested in seeing how mounts are incorported, whether they simply increase movement/have an attack or are seperate entities to their rider for hitting purposes. I hope for the latter.

Oh, and Mammoths as well. I like Mammoths.

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April 20, 2010 7:25:13 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

I would hope that mounts are their own entity, have their own HP and Defense (and potentially attack). However, I would not have the defense of Mount and Soldier stack, I would instead have incoming attacks target one or the other (usually the rider) ... I am not certain how killing the mount would effect the rider (perhaps falls off and is stunned for a round w/o a mount?). However if the rider was killed, the mount could either run off, or (in the case of elephants) go bezerk and start to stomp about attacking whatever is near.

However, I wouldn't mind if Mounts were simply extra speed, extra HP, and potentially an extra attack.

On to Champions ... I would like for Mounts to be treated largely as "Equipment" from the Sovereign/Champion point of view. So that a Sovereign can equip a horse, and now be riding a horse, or equip an Elephant and now be riding an elephant.

I would certainly like for mounts to effect HP in some way, so we can have light and fast things (eagles, Wargs) and big and slow things (Elephants) to actually have their own pros and cons vs simply Faster or Slower ... since elephants would be nature appear to be more expensive AND more useful (in reality) ... however if its just a matter of speed then the Elephant would become a non-choosable "choice" or a non-choice (negative version).

Basically, any mount slower than a horse needs to have something "extra" about it to still be worthwhile.

For an Elephant this could be increased HP (and defense?)

while an Armadillo could be increased HP and defense.

A hippo could be (slightly) increased HP, and an extra attack. However since hippos seem "silly" their could be a monstrous version of basically the same thing under a different name (Hippo Sized Swamp creature with a giant toothy mouth).

Rhinos could definitely (I think) have the same speed as a horse (or a bit slower) ... and a Charge that is MUCH more powerful. Not only a faster charge, but a more deadly one ... probably not an extra "animal attack" but instead a rather large "attack bonus" to the charge. As well as a potential option for stampede/trampling ... of destroying your opponents beneath the speed and weight of the monster. I mean ... if you think a Horse Charge is bad ... a Rhino is out-right deadly. Almost overpowered even

Dang ... I really want Rhino Cavalry now!!! ... the one bad thing about Rhinos is that if you kill their rider they go bezerk, potentially harming its allies ... as well as probably rare and/or hard to train/ expensive upkeep.

Potentially, Rhinos could be a rarer mount to tame than a drake, specifically because Rhinos (as war-mounts) are amazing. Perhaps it could be a Faction Specific mount, and require a certain number of "racial points" to enable the taming of Rhinos (or simply a points value allowing the taming of all wild and deadly beasts ... including hippos).

Essentially my idea of trample, is that if a charge kills the soldier in front of it, then that Rhino moves to the next soldier, for a free (extra) attack charge. Theoretically it could go through a whole line of infantry in this way. Of course you could find yourself in the quandary of having some Rhinos on one side of the opposing infantry, and some Rhinos on the other side.

One thing I liked about Dawn of War was that if a large beast was attacking units in a melee, the soldiers would scatter (even if part of the same unit) and would regroup when/if possible. Perhaps a similar game mechanic could be in play for particular devastating charges, specifically if using a large and deadly mount like a Rhino or other large creature. That is, even if the unit attacked is not killed, sucessful attacks = the unit is knocked to the side, and the Rhino (or monster) either stands there in the middle of where the unit once was (now scattered) or runs to the other side. In this case, a Rhino Charge would be more like a bowling ball knocking over pins than a real cavalry charge. Being knocked over could cause "some" damage, as well as being stunned for a combat turn or two.

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April 24, 2010 9:42:39 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

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